My kids going Raw

[silverphoenix69]

1. How many ferrets do you currently have? What are their names, ages, genders, and do they have any health problems (this is VERY important)?

4 Ferrets.
Bandit: 2 years old. Male, had Adrenal Surgery in April and nothing wrong since then
Drake: 1 year 10 months old. Male, no health problems right now, though he is deaf.
Laura: Around 2 years old. Female, no health problems right now
Gloria: Around 3 years old. Female, is Adrenal. Had both the right and left adrenal glands Surgically removed November 07 and July 15/08. She is now on Percortin injections once a month.

2. What are your ferrets currently eating? Include their main diet, plus any treats or supplements (such as duk soup).

Totally Ferret, Evo cat food and 8 in 1 Ultimate. They get ferretone once a day to every other day as a treat (not to much). They also have home made duck soup once in a while. Oh and I’ll give them a piece of T/D feline as a treat, vet said it was fine as long as they didn’t get to much, said one to two pieces a day was ok. I give about 1 piece once a day or every other day.

3. What kind of diet do you want to switch to?

A raw and whole pray diet. They will also have access to kibble some of the time, as I can’t completely cut it out of their diet.

4. Why do you want to switch to this more natural diet?

So that they’re more healthy, have a better chance to live longer, and it just seems like the better choice than just kibble

5. Where/what/who got you interested in natural diets?

I’ve been reading about it since before I got Bandit and Drake, but wasn’t sure about it. Then a friend of mine feeds raw to her ferrets and I just decided that I’d do it

6. Please list the current weight for your ferret(s). Do they appear overweight? Underweight? How is there muscle tone?
Weights taken September 30th

Bandit: 1221g
Drake: 1474g
Laura: 823g
Gloria 791g

Non appear over weight, I would like Bandit to gain a bit more, as well as the girls (Laura and Gloria). Laura lost a lot of her winter weight this summer but they aren’t “underweight”. They could just gain a few more grams. I’m not sure about muscle tone, I'm guessing they don't have the best muscle tone.

7. What is the condition of your ferret's teeth/gums? (can you get a picture?)

Bandit has the best looking teeth/gums. He has a little bit of tarter. Drake also has a little bit of tarter, and his gums look pretty good. Laura also has tarter, and her gums are a bit red, same as Gloria. Gloria is at the vet once a month, and the doctor said her teeth and gums look very good for her age.

I'll try to get pictures later.

8. Describe the texture/color of your ferrets coat.

Bandit has nice semi thick coat. Drake’s fur is a bit thin, semi soft. Laura has the softest nicest fur of them all, and Gloria’s fur is thin but getting thicker now that her adrenal glands are gone, as well as soft again .

9. How often does your ferret go to the bathroom?
Around ever 3-5 hours

10. Does your ferret's feces and/or urine smell?

Not really, I don’t notice it unless I find a pile under my bed (which they WONT be doing much longer)

11. Smell your ferret. How strong is their odor?

None of them have a very strong smell.

12. On a scale of 1-10, 1 being completely lethargic and 10 being "through the roof!" what is your ferret's energy level?

Bandit would be about a 8-9, Drake a 7-8, Laura a 7 and Gloria a 5-7

13. How excited is your ferret about meal time (when fed kibble)?

Bandit is the only one that comes running when he hears me refill the food bowl

14. Have you attempted to switch from kibble to a natural diet in the past? If so, what methods have you tried. Be specific.

Not really, I offered them some chicken or turkey and they wouldn’t take it. Gloria was the only one that took a bite of chicken before

15. What other information about your ferret(s) would you like to share?

Bandit it seems never sleeps. He’s always a wake and follows me around! Laura and Gloria are my sucky babies and Drake is my lap ferret

16. If you can, please post a clear photograph of EACH of your ferrets directly below:

They were taken in April, I'll post newer ones later.
Bandit:
img.photobucket.com/albums/v600/SilverPhoenix69/Ferrets/2008_0330021.jpg

Drake:
img.photobucket.com/albums/v600/SilverPhoenix69/Ferrets/2008_0416016.jpg

Laura:
img.photobucket.com/albums/v600/SilverPhoenix69/Ferrets/2008_0416021.jpg

Gloria:
img.photobucket.com/albums/v600/SilverPhoenix69/Ferrets/2008_0416005.jpg

And a link of all the pics I have uploaded online:
smg.photobucket.com/albums/v600/SilverPhoenix69/Ferrets/?start=36

17.

a.) Do you understand that by starting this thread you commit to posting updates on the progress of your ferret(s) diet switch atleast every other day?**
I do.

b.) Do you understand that if you will be away from your computer for an extended period of time you will need to exchange phone numbers (or email addresses if you don't feel comfortable exchanging numbers)via private message with your assigned mentor, so that we can monitor your progress and ensure your ferret's saftey during the switch?
I understand and will give my mentor my email address, I don't like phones and barely talk on them.

c.) Do you understand that any threads that have not been updated in for more then a week (with no explaination as to why you are absent) will result in the deletion of the thread?***
I understand

**Note 1: If you are unable to make it to a computer (such as on weekends) please indicate below so we know whether you just dont have computer access or if you have gone MIA. ***Note 2: If you would like to try the switch again and you are committed to making regular updates you ARE welcome to restart your thread. Failure to provide regular updates will result in the deletion of your thread.

[silverphoenix69]

I posted in the Newbie section that grounded up some chicken breast. ALL of them ate some of it. Gloria was the first to eat it! Then Bandit. Drake and Laura weren't to sure, and when I put some on Laura's tongue she acted like I poisoned her LOL. All of that was feeding them from my finger. So I added some ferretone and then they all took it from my finger no problem, then from the plate a bit!

I took away their kibble from the cage, and put the chicken there instead. Laura was looking at me like "wheres my food?" But I just left it.

I don't really know what to do next. Should I just leave that out for them and make sure that they are all eating it? Should I put the kibble back later tonight, to make sure they're all eating something?

[Jaycee]

I would keep going with the ground raw. Two are eating it willingly....I think if you go back to kibble they may rebel and take longer to switch. I had to feed mine from finger, spoon and dropper at first, but they will get the hang of it. Sounds like you are doing well so far!

[meli]

I second the sticking with the ground til they are fully transitioned.

[Jaycee]

Ok, I just now got around to reading your other posting, and I thought I would respond here instead. You asked about ferret illness, and the vets possibly placing them on kibble if an extended stay is needed. I would say that it probably isn't a bad idea to give it to them from to time. Plus, you never know if there is an emergency and they will need to be fed kibble. Maybe give it just as a treat every now and then....after they have made the transition to raw, that is!

[Forum Administrator]

Also, if you'd rather not feed kibble another viable option is freeze-dried raw foods such as Stella and Chewy's, Wysong, and AFS. All of these are dry and easy to feed, just like kibble and the vet should not have an objection to feeding it. They are somewhat expensive but if you only feed them as meals to the ferts when they are in the hospital, etc, then it should work out just fine. You can buy these foods at stinkweasels.com or casey's hidden pantry (online). To get them used to the taste of these foods, just feed them occasionally as a treat You can use kibble too, but honestly the freeze dried is alot healthier (then again if you only feed the kibble occasionally it probably wont hurt). Ultimately its up to you.

Also, on a side note most ferrets that were raised and originally imprinted on kibble will never "forget" that they used to eat kibble. Young kits that are put directly onto raw before imprinting on kibble will often turn their noses up when offered kibble, but the older ones usually will eat it if you offer it. So you might not even have to worry about offering it to them so they "remember its edible". When you get them on raw you arent making them forget about kibble (having them imprint on raw in place of kibble) you are simply expanding their horizons to include other food sources. All of your guys are atleast one year old. I wouldnt worry about them "forgetting" that they can eat kibble

I hope this helps.

[silverphoenix69]

Ok I'll keep on the raw, see how it goes...Gloria so far is the only one that will go and eat it...well lick at it a bit. I wonder if she was fed Raw before she was found by the shelter, its possible. Though one of the volunteers at the shelter said they offered her some raw chicken before and she wouldn't touch it. Who knows.

How long would the ground chicken stay "good" with ferretone added to it? It's been about 6 hours since I made it.

After they're used to raw, and eating it normally. I think I will give them kibble as treats. I want to have some in the house for emergencies just in case at all times.

Thanks Giuliana, I'll check in to that stuff as well...See if my dad will let me use his credit card again. One question though, if they're from the states will they ship over the boarder?

Thanks again Jaycee and Meli for all your help

[silverphoenix69]

So my mentor's are Jaycee and Meli, I'm so happy

I went up to check on the ferrets again. I should mention that they're almost 100% free roam of my bedroom. They used to have full run of the downstairs, upstairs including just my room and the hallways, and the hallway on the third floor until the girls came. Couldn't ferret proof safe enough for them as they could get under the couch. So for now they're stuck to my room, or the stairs, second floor hallway and the third floor hallway.

Anyways. Someone was eating the chicken, probably Gloria but could have been one of the others. Bandit was up so I finger fed him a good amount of it, until he wanted to go. The others were sleeping and I didn't want to disturb them.

So far so good

[meli]

I feed my guys freeze dried meats. So if you need help in that area and suggestions I can definetly help ya out. I also feed them whole prey as well as live prey. So don't hestitate to ask. Jaycee and I went through our transition together basically. So we'll guide ya!

[silverphoenix69]

So I just put the kids to bed. I think that at least for now, I'm gonna put them in their cage at night, to make sure that they're all eating and pooping properly.

Drake won't eat it at all unless there is ferretone on it. Laura will as soon as she realizes that its not poison off my finger. I'm not to worried about Bandit and Gloria not eating on there own, at least right now.

Should the chicken that I ground up at 5pm be ok until about 12pm tomorrow? Or should I make them a new batch now (its 1am)

Thanks Meli, I'll need to do some more research on freeze dried meat. I know nothing about it really . Do you buy it that way, like the links from Giuliana or do you do it yourself? If so how?

[Jaycee]

If it is cut up chicken, you might want to replace it before noon. My chicken would get hard and smelly by then. But, the raw meaty bones like wings and legs can usually sit out much longer. I would say, for me, the chunks could probably sit out 10 hours, but anything ground up only 6 to 8 hours. I use to bribe mine with ferretone and vite to get them to eat. It was always my "icing" on my "meat cakes" that I would serve them. I just lessened the amounts over time. Vite and Tone I think are full of sugar, which isn't good for ferrets, but like the kibble I think using during the transition is ok.

As for how long to leave the chunks out that are covered in tone, you might need to use your own discretion. Is it hard, smells bad.....green??? (by the way, green isn't a good color for chicken)

[buzzonesbirdie]

The general rule for raw food is

Wet Kibble: 4-8 hours
Ground meat: 12 hours
Freeze-dried Diet (served wet) 12 hours
Commercial Raw frozen diet 12 hours
Meat chunks: 16 hours
Bone-in meat: 24 hours
Whole prey (meat exposed): 24 hours
Whole prey (no meat exposed) 36 hours
Freeze-dried diet (served dry) Over 1 week (the primary concern is palatability rather than bacterial issues)

This of course depends on the temp in your house. Always use your judgement.

BTW Great Job Meli and Jaycee

[silverphoenix69]

Thank you Jaycee and buzzonesbirdie

Well know one touched it last night, except a few licks. And there was to very runny poops in their litter box. I don't really know what to do next. I put there kibble back for now, they all had nothing to eat for almost 24 hours except little licks of the chicken. And I don't like how they didn't all poop. I'll take the kibble away again when I get back around 5pm (leaving at 2:40pm) and start again. Is there a way to do this that I can leave the kibble for them at night? So that they don't starve?

Also, I changed the food last night before I went to bed. Figured it was the best thing to do.

[Forum Administrator]

If they aren't eating, then yes, put the kibble back. Put HALF of what they'd normally eat into the cage, and then leave them with the soupie. Another option is to give them kibble during the day (a little less then you'd normally feed) and then leave the raw in overnight.

Are you feeding ground chicken or chunks of chicken? If they refuse to eat, take a step back, grind it finer, warm it slightly, or try to spoon feed them. Its important that they eat SOMETHING. Not eating for over 24 hours warrants giving them something, even if its kibble. The key is that even if you give them the kibble back, you dont let them pig out and fill up on it. you give them a reduced amount

[silverphoenix69]

Thanks Giuli.

They're eating, well when I finger feed them, ground up chicken, kinda looks like a spread LOL. No chunks. They eat it if I get them to, but not if I leave it. Other then the few licks from last night. Drake wont touch it unless there is ferretone on it.

I didn't think of the reduced amount of kibble *hits head*. I'll have to go back to get the name, but someone said that I could try to cut the chicken in kibble sized bits and dust them with kibble. I'll see if that works.

I don't like that they didn't poop, and the two that were in there were runny. I guess once they're used to it it'll go away but...lol I'm just a worry wart.