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Post by bindiferret89 on Aug 5, 2009 4:09:59 GMT -5
OK, I watched Nuka eat all the ground meat I offered tonight and Moki ate some of the soup when I shut her up by herself. When she laid down in her hammock, Ginny and Lucinda had quite a bit of soup. Sully just stashed the chicken wing (and his bowl! LOL) and saved it for later. After an hour, he hadn't touched it yet, though I did leave food with him most of the day, so he may not have been as hungry. I came back downstairs figuring he'd get it later. Moki doesn't seem to eat as much and I'm concerned with monitoring whether or not Nuka is eating any of the bone or if she is getting any wings at all now that Sully has decided they're his favorite. I may have to start utilizing both of my ferret carries to separate Moki and Nuka during dinner time so that I can watch them more closely. It just gets difficult with five of them to know exactly who is eating what and how much, and once the older girls are eating ground and whole meats, I can only imagine it will get tougher. Would it be appropriate to put Nuka in one carrier and Moki in the other for a short period of time, say, an hour? I think I read somewhere on these forums that they will learn to eat within an allotted time period if they are repeatedly only given that much time to eat, right? I also had to practically force-feed Moki, Ginny, and Lucinda some of the bits of watered down ground chicken, but they did chew little pieces up and swallow them, so it's a start.  On another interesting note, I saw Jes yesterday and she said the holistic food store here also sells some pet products, including Nature's Variety raw! And it's not too expensive. She said it's under $20.00 (she couldn't remember the exact number) for the three pound bag of medallions. I might go over today to see what flavors they carry and if they have any other raw pet foods that would be appropriate for ferrets, or the ability to order them. I'm going away the last week of September and if I can't find someone comfortable feeding regular raw to them, the medallions might be a good option. |
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Post by spiritualtramp on Aug 5, 2009 13:04:50 GMT -5
The medallions are a good back up to have on hand for those types of trips out of town and such. It's a good idea to get them at least used to them. Here I pay between 9-16 dollars for NV frozen raw, depending on the meat. The chicken and beef are cheapest, the rabbit and venison more expensive. I've only ever fed the rabbit and the venison, since chicken is a staple already in my house, and beef is a no-no for Ranger. But they like it well enough and it's easy. Someone posted a thread that Pet Supplies Plus was having a sale on NV, I don't know if you have any of those around, but give it a looksie. Also, I believe there are some coupons for a free bag on NV out there somewhere. I think if you check the site and register or something they'll email you one. In the beginning I separated the kids to feed, too, to better monitor their intakes. So utilizing the carriers is a good idea, and can be helpful since they wouldn't be submitting food to alphas and all that nonsense. In fact I had set up two carriers and a spare cage at one point so that everyone was alone to eat. I'm glad the girls are starting to take to the ground That's great news! Keep the force feeding them up and they'll quickly pick up the idea. For Nuka, I'd cut up some wing tips for her and offer them in a carrier, to give her a chance to try them. You're right, ferrets do get accustomed to feeding times so my guess is if you offer the food at the same times daily, she'll eat up while she has the chance in the carrier. Good luck and let me know how the separate feedings work out. |
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Post by bindiferret89 on Aug 7, 2009 9:14:33 GMT -5
Just checking in! The ferrets are doing well. I handfed some more ground to the older girls yesterday, and while no one has moved forward yet, we're not moving backward either, so I consider that a plus! Moki, Ginny, and Lucinda, took well to the blended turkey/chicken mix, so the turkey flavor definitely doesn't bother them.
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Post by spiritualtramp on Aug 7, 2009 9:45:12 GMT -5
That's wonderful news to hear. Keep it up, they're doing great. You're well on your way, my friend |
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Post by bindiferret89 on Aug 7, 2009 12:09:58 GMT -5
Went ferret grocery shopping at the other grocery store today, but they don't carry chicken or turkey necks either, so eventually I'll have to order those. However, I did find some great sales! Six chicken wings for $1.50 and beef for $2.00! Yay for buying things right before the sell-by date! I also picked up two CGH, which were a little expensive (about $7.50 for the 2 pack), but are going to be well worth it since Sully and Nuka could definitely eat one at this point, even if Sully is the only one eating the bones. I wasn't feeling well last night, so my boyfriend made me eggs and saved all the egg shells. I rinsed them out and dried them so I can use them in soups to supplement the calcium the other girls aren't getting right now. I also stopped by the health food store today and got two 1lb trial packs of NV, one lamb and one chicken. Buying their lamb medallions actually comes out to be cheaper than buying lamb at the grocery store AND they get the bone content that they wouldn't get from grocery store lamb. They were $5.60 each for the 1lb bags and the 3lb bags range from $14.00 (chicken) to $20.00 (rabbit). They can order any flavor (chicken, rabbit, venison, lamb, beef, salmon) and there is a 15% discount if I ever decide to order them by the case. Because it would help supplement their calcium and it's not as expensive as I thought it would be, I'm thinking of making two of their weekly PM meals NV, one mice, and adjusting the others to stay within the frankenprey ratios. What do you think? Update around 8:41 PM: Success! (Sort Of) This afternoon, the ferrets had eaten their morning food completely and were all sniffing around like they were really hungry again, so I fed them early and figured I'd give them a third meal late tonight if they ate all that. I left Moki, Ginny, and Lucinda some ground chicken and planned to give them soup tonight if they didn't eat it. Well, SOMEBODY has been eating it! I saw all of them licking the juice out of it earlier, but I just checked on them and a quarter of the bowl is empty now! As for Sully and Nuka...hurrah! We have our first solid poops! (Silly thing to be excited about, but oh god were those soupy poops awful!) |
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Post by bindiferret89 on Aug 8, 2009 3:06:27 GMT -5
Gah, sorry for posting twice, but I've got raw on the mind tonight, lol. I'm finding, now that my furkids are in two separate stages of the switch, that I'm having a hard time planning what and how much to pull from the freezer to thaw in order to give them balance and still adapt to each ferret’s preferences, so for the time being, I'm planning tentative weekly menus for each group, for my benefit more than anything. Once we're all on the same page, then I can stick with one standard menu. I just can’t keep worrying about thawing too much of one thing or another and then it going bad. LOL, it seems like every time I think I have a good menu in my head, I find some way to improve it.  So here's my plan... Sully and Nuka will eat soups, ground (including NV), chunks, hearts & gizzards, and Sully will eat bone. I still haven't seen Nuka eat bone, but I haven't had time to separate her and really watch her this week either, so that's on the agenda. They have tried and accepted chicken, turkey, pork, beef (no more weird poopies!), and lamb. So for them, I'm sticking to the basic menu I posted for you to review a few days ago, since you said it looked good, and also adding in the NV in the evening. I may alter a few things here and there to use what I've already pulled for this week, but they are still getting the types of meat (RMB, boneless, organ) on the days that I specified, and I have them scheduled for 5 different sources of meat, so I think it's going to be very balanced for them. Moki, Ginny, and Lucinda will eat soups and ground (they ultimately ate over half of it last night) and have tried and accepted chicken and turkey. My goal for them is to introduce one new flavor per week, if they will accept it, until they are eating the same variety as the younger kids. I'm going to introduce pork or lamb this week, as those seem to be the flavors that Sully and Nuka go crazy for. For their menu, I took Sully & Nuka's menu and modified it to replace RMB's with NV or soup with eggshells. Otherwise they all get boneless meats on the same days and Moki, Ginny, and Lucinda will get soup with organs on organ day. While the ratios are still a little imbalanced and they aren't getting the same variety as the youngin's, I think it's still more balanced than plain soup all the time. If they are readily accepting ground by the end of the week, I'll try small chunks of meat (whichever flavor they seem to like best) next Saturday. If not, I will continue with ground meats, but gradually mix the chunks in with it. I think this method might be a good, slow progression into different flavors and textures without overwhelming them with too many new things at once. But I'd definitely like to hear what you think, and please let me know if you think I'm pushing them along too quickly. Sully and Nuka seem to take to everything almost instantly, but I know a more patient, gradual method is in order for the others. Anyway, we've been a kibble-free house for over a week now, so I can't complain! Now it's just a matter of balancing everything out! By the way, I popped into the switch archive forum today and read through some older threads, including yours! I love reading other people's mentor threads because it gives me a more well-rounded idea of the different methods of switching that are out there. Everyone's ferrets are so different and it's cool to see how methods can be changed and tailored to fit each ferret and ferrent's needs and goals. *does the happy, I'm-learning-stuff dance* Okay, four in the morning and still caffeinated...I'm off to do something else productive till I crash and fall asleep, haha. Sorry for the looooong, confusing posts. I imagine you've been really busy the past few days and I promise not to post anymore till I give you time to catch up. Hope everything's going well and please give your kiddos hugs for me! |
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Post by spiritualtramp on Aug 8, 2009 17:46:15 GMT -5
Hey there crazy caffeinated lady!! You sure wrote a lot in the past day hahaha, I feel like I haven't been around in a million years but it's only been a day! Sorry! I was busy with work, picking up extra hours, and then this weekend is my town's big fair/festival so I've been spending my time with that, too. Good idea adding the eggshells, I meant to mention that the other day but I forgot (oops.) Eggshells are a good supplement but not always digested well (you'll see the pieces in their poos, I'm sure.) Also, eggshells don't contain *all* the nutrients that marrow/bone does - so while it's a good supplement for now, I like to warn people that eggshells are not a full time replacement for bone. Your kids will do fine with your menu though and the NV is a good source of those nutrients, too. So I am not too worried right now. That approach and menu sounds good, just don't jump ahead of the older kids if they aren't ready to move along yet. I know you're getting excited and into this but you have to remember that it's the fuzzy ones who dictate this So go ahead and try to offer new meats over the next week to the older ones, hopefully they'll take to it. Keep a close eye on who eats and who does not, though, because it can be easy to overlook someone in a larger group, when two are eating and one is not, etc. Hand-feed when necessary (introducing new flavors might require this.) It might be wise to set up some carriers for feeding dens just to be certain, even if you just separate one at each meal, you'll be able to gauge where they are after a few meals. You're doing great, and I love how into the process and the learning you are. It makes my job easier when you do all you can to understand diet and nutrition. And I really think you're doing amazingly and am so lucky to have you as a student . Let me know your updated menus when you're feeling solidified about it. I'm interested to see! |
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Post by bindiferret89 on Aug 8, 2009 19:23:03 GMT -5
That's actually why I set the goals for the older girls...I was trying to slow myself down a bit and let them take their time. I felt like I was holding my expectations too high for them at times and I realized that they're doing really well too, it's just taking them a little longer. They ate 100% of their ground chicken this morning, which was a mix of grocery chicken and smashed NV medallions. The medallions didn't go as well at first, but eventually they ate them, and I was able to clearly witness all three of them eating it. I'm offering ground to them for dinner too. I think I'm going to separate Nuka and give each of them wings.
I gave Sully & Nuka a whole chicken thigh today just to see what they'd do with it and they looked at me like I was INSANE, hahaha. Oh well. I cut it into smaller pieces and they ate all the boneless meat, but there's still some meat on the bone up there which they haven't touched.
The two female mice I'm breeding are past their expected due date by a few days and look like they are going to POP at any second, so my ferrets are hoping for warm, juicy mouse babies within a few days. I'm going to hold off introducing whole prey indefinitely, as they seem to have enough on their plates (no pun intended) with everything else they're learning to eat. In the mean time, my snakes will take care of those mice if there become too many of them, lol.
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Post by spiritualtramp on Aug 9, 2009 21:25:42 GMT -5
Wow sounds great, those girls just keep pulling all the surprises huh? And you're right, EVERYONE is doing really well so far, and it's important to remember that! Sully and Nuka are babies and naturally more open minded but even the older girls are moving remarkably quickly.
Haha about the thigh, that's too funny. It'll be a but before they get to that stage but I bet if you leave a bone like that in with them, they'll soon learn to try to eat it.
I'm jealous about your mouse colony, sincerely. I wish I had the room and means to start one myself but I live in a small apartment and that's just not a viable option. It would save money though so you'll be glad to have it.
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Post by bindiferret89 on Aug 9, 2009 22:45:31 GMT -5
Not much to update, but I did want to let you know that Sully chewed the smaller end of the thigh bone and ate as much marrow as he could out of it.
When I separated Nuka last night, she ate one whole wing, including bone, and part of a second one. At least now I know they're both eating bone, but I think I'm going to keep separating Nuka from time to time on RMB days because Sully tends to be a bit of a pig with them, lol. She was extremely happy to be back with her buddy when I took her out of the carrier though, lol. They are just the cutest little pair!
The other girls are doing well on ground NV chicken.
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Post by bindiferret89 on Aug 9, 2009 23:04:19 GMT -5
Correction to my last post...Nuka ate part of one chicken wing, including some of the bone, but not all of it. The WHOLE wing I thought she was eating was found just now, rolled up in the pillowcase I'd given her to snuggle with.  LOL! Tonight is soup night for all of them. The older girls are getting chicken, and I've separated Moki out tonight because I want to monitor how much she eats. The younger two can get a little pushy sometimes at dinnertime, even with Moki being dominant. Sully and Nuka are getting beef soup, which Ginny got a taste of and, surprisingly, seems to like as well! |
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Post by spiritualtramp on Aug 10, 2009 20:51:42 GMT -5
All bits of good news! The bone in the pillowcase --- well now you know why I skewer and clip meats Keep it up, they're all doing soooooo well. I love that Ginny liked the beef, too! What a girl!! You can start trying the older girls on other meats now if you want |
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Post by bindiferret89 on Aug 10, 2009 21:02:16 GMT -5
Well, two steps forward, one step back, lol...the older girls won't eat plain ground for me now, at least not very much of it. Maybe I should stick to soups in different flavors for now and then work them up to ground later?
If I add water to the ground to make it somewhat soupy, they'll eat some of it that way, stop when it gets chunky again, I add more water...and repeat, lol. Is that okay?
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Post by spiritualtramp on Aug 11, 2009 16:43:46 GMT -5
That's fine, but honestly? I think they're just testing you They've eaten it before; they recognize it as food; don't indulge their every whim!! Force feed bits of it if necessary --- they'll get the hint  |
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Post by bindiferret89 on Aug 11, 2009 17:30:10 GMT -5
Good to know, haha.
Well, 4 of them had their ADV tests today (Nuka's still a little young, Mary said) and I'll have the results in about a week.
On tonight's menu: NV rabbit for Sully & Nuka (first time with rabbit!) and ground pork mixed with NV chicken for the others since they DID eat more of the chicken this morning and I'm hoping the familiar flavor will entice them to try the new one.
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