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Post by katt on Jan 10, 2011 14:49:11 GMT -5
I have to disagree. The issue with Marshalls is Not due primarily to kibble. Yes that is a major part of it but another Major issue is that they wean them and alter them too young. Other mills do this as well but other mills also feed kibble. So that doesn't necessarily explain the higher rate of disease in Marshalls ferts.
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vkp23
Going Natural
Posts: 192
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Post by vkp23 on Jan 10, 2011 16:06:51 GMT -5
OOOHHHH OK. yeah I see where that's bad too. But as far as the conditions they are kept I haven't heard any thing. Have any of you? I'm really curious about that. I've actually looked for it and couldn't find anything about how they are housed and cared for. Other than what their site says, but you know we can't really trust that.
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Post by Heather on Jan 10, 2011 16:31:59 GMT -5
Hmmm Marshals farms...they've come a long way with their ferrets The facility....we had a couple of members on here that were living just down the road from them...had to deal with a couple of little ones who escaped if I remember correctly, a jill specifically. Knowing what I'm aware of now, she was probably a lab animal...she was tagged not tatooed. Ok, I remember reading a bit about them in a ferret magazine which is now defuncted. Originally their ferrets were for hunters and sold as such (yes, they've been around that long). Hunting was then banned in North America and they moved on to pets and lab animals. We actually have 5 little ones who were saved from that fate (little sweeties, they drive their person crazy ) They also raise beagles for the same purpose...lab animals. They have run afoul of the law on occasion regarding their lab animals, this was in the article that I read (I'm sure you can google a lot of the information if you know how). Their ferrets come from 3 lines that were imported from Europe (don't get excited all ferrets came from there originally ). They are bred specifically for temperament. They have to have some of the softest most docile ferrets that I've ever seen. For a beginner who wants a ferret they're awesome (no I'm not condoning their practices just stating a fact ) They are generally very pliable and easy to handle. They're not necessarily the smartest or the most inquisitive so it stands to reason why they're such a big seller. By the way this was not a referrence to the attitude of their lab animals...who by the way seem to have some attitude issues Unfortunately, because of their breeding practices they may not get the most healthy animals, the spay/neuter too early (but then all the farms do ), they take them away from their mommas way too early (again a common practice with farms) By the way, that's partially our fault because we want cute tiny babies to love and snuggle, if they stay for any period of time they're not cute tiny babies any more . After all ferrets grow surprisingly fast. That may also be why Marshals ferrets are also very small. It's also commercially viable to create an animal that doesn't live very long. Let's face it if you can get the animal to die sooner, you will go out an by another......right?? Sorry, it's all about business, they're not there to "not" make money. So, the long of it is.....it's not about the kibble, it's not about the early vaccine...it's about the "whole package" that there's an issue . ciao
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vkp23
Going Natural
Posts: 192
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Post by vkp23 on Jan 10, 2011 19:49:42 GMT -5
Yeah I usually first looked at how they were housed (Are the cages over crowded and dirty) and whether or not they had any human interaction. But you're absolutely right. It IS a whole package deal. I had no idea they raise lab animals too. It's funny you mention how people want the babies. That's SO true, but funny enough, when I bought Miko I actually wanted to take the older male they had there that they couldn't sell. The pet store lady said for bonding reasons with having the kids and all that it would be better to pick one of the baby's. I love Miko to death any way and she fits in with us perfect!
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Post by rarnold18 on Jan 10, 2011 20:17:49 GMT -5
The pet store lady said for bonding reasons with having the kids and all that it would be better to pick one of the baby's. quote] really??? I mean I would understand babies bonding with their humans....but to discourage you from buying an older fuzz that wasn't selling is...grrrr....can't think of a nice word... there are ways to bond with older ferrets. Heck none of my now 12 (2 are at the bridge) were younger than a year or two when they came home and I've never had a problem with them bonding to at least one person here at the house...and I have 3 kids ages 2, 5, and 11... Gypsy our oldest came home in Nov. and she's about 5-7 years and our youngest Fuzz are at least 2-3 now, even the "baby" that I brought home last week is nowhere near 4m old looking at her teeth... I've never had any problems with the kids being around them (supervised of course with rules, everyone must be sitting on the floor and if they get up they're out of the room!) The only two I would worry about are my two abused/neglected girls and even they have improved tremendously in the 6 months they've been here... I don't know.... that just burns my britchs.... all fuzz even the older ones deserve loving caring furever homes and to think that that chick discouraged you from doing so....ugh.... they ones that don't sell get sent back to Marshalls to be destroyed.... poor baby, I will say a prayer for him....I hope he did find a home.... * not knocking you for your decision but the sales person...grrr!*
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Post by mjohn143 on Jan 10, 2011 20:29:47 GMT -5
Yea I was told the ones that don't sell are sent back for animal testing. It really makes me sick bc yes you can boycott all their products and ferrets but you CAN NOT change anything. I know many people are against them, and for valid reasons. BUT that same reason is why I choose to buy Marshall's ferrets, bc I can at least save a few. I mean my sweet baby Clovis was ab to be sent back, that is why I had to get him. There is just no winning.
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vkp23
Going Natural
Posts: 192
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Post by vkp23 on Jan 10, 2011 20:31:37 GMT -5
[/quote]really??? I mean I would understand babies bonding with their humans....but to discourage you from buying an older fuzz that wasn't selling is...grrrr....can't think of a nice word... there are ways to bond with older ferrets. Heck none of my now 12 (2 are at the bridge) were younger than a year or two when they came home and I've never had a problem with them bonding to at least one person here at the house...and I have 3 kids ages 2, 5, and 11... Gypsy our oldest came home in Nov. and she's about 5-7 years and our youngest Fuzz are at least 2-3 now, even the "baby" that I brought home last week is nowhere near 4m old looking at her teeth... I've never had any problems with the kids being around them (supervised of course with rules, everyone must be sitting on the floor and if they get up they're out of the room!) The only two I would worry about are my two abused/neglected girls and even they have improved tremendously in the 6 months they've been here... I don't know.... that just burns my britchs.... all fuzz even the older ones deserve loving caring furever homes and to think that that chick discouraged you from doing so....ugh.... they ones that don't sell get sent back to Marshalls to be destroyed.... poor baby, I will say a prayer for him....I hope he did find a home.... * not knocking you for your decision but the sales person...grrr!*[/quote] Yeah I thought it was weird too. I mean I had done my research on them BEFORE I got one but there was still a lot I had yet to learn (some of those things you don't REALLY learn til you own one) and was taking her word for it. I had dealt with this lady before concerning pet rats, and she seems the type who is like all into the natural pet care thing and everything. I found it strange she didn't think I should get him. He was big and beautiful too and just fell asleep in my arms. I did go back later and she said he had found a home. I would have taken both of them if I had the $400 it would have taken to bring him home also. I just brought two 2 yr old rescues home yesterday and they already have settled in just fine. The little girl "Zip" has REALLY taken to my daughter Lizzy and was sleeping in her lap just loving being pet on. They were neglected and have just lapped up the love since we got them home.
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Post by sherrylynne on Jan 10, 2011 22:13:43 GMT -5
I'm wondering if the older kit maybe found a home with either her, or a friend of hers And yes, I got one that was about to be sent back as well. She was 8 months old at the time. And she's so full of spunk, it's unbelievable
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Post by mustelidmusk on Jan 10, 2011 22:48:42 GMT -5
I loved my Marshall's boys every bit as much as I love my current 4. Every little furball has his/her own dance I still miss them after 7-8 years. -jennifer
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Post by miamiferret2 on Jan 10, 2011 22:56:04 GMT -5
i hear that path valley farms ferrets are healthier but they ship as far as virginia i think. only marshalls at the pet stores here. the ferret shelters are also full of marshalls ferrets down here. i have had varying experiences. btw, speaking of Ferret's magazine, if any of you have the march/april 2008 issue (it was actually the last one ever to be in print) one of my ferrets won the "picture perfect" contest in that issue. my boy is on page 6. he was such a good boy. i miss him.
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Post by Heather on Jan 11, 2011 0:51:53 GMT -5
Path Valleys may be healthier but they have 'tude. A lot of pet stores won't carry them because they're notorious biters. There were 5 pet stores in my general area that carried ferrets. Three of them carried Path Valley (one of the reasons why all of my brats were PV's) None of them carry them now. They were getting them as vicious returns, people didn't know how to deal with them. The pet stores would tell them to do the scruff and drag, which if you do with most PV's will get you attacked and bitten. They don't respond well to rough discipline. They do really awesome to time outs and treats, soft discipline. They're very intellegent, so the boredom of a time out is worse than any scruff you will give them ciao
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Post by miamiferret2 on Jan 11, 2011 8:13:29 GMT -5
I have heard about the pvf ferrets being more "wild." Lol. One of the vets that we used in the early 90's was a ferret breeder and I know that he was inbreeding. I know he was not importing new ferrets from Europe to introduce new bloodlines. So marshalls are not the only ones inbreeding. It appears that late neuters also develop adrenal, insulinoma and lymphoma. From the 90's to now there have been so many advances in veterinary medicine for ferrets. When we started having ferrets as pets, there were very few vets that treated them. You'd go in and ask "why is my ferret losing his fur?" And we'd hear things like "oh, it is old age or a skin allergy." This wad back when vets recommended dry kitten food and bananas as treats.....I never had the option if using deslorelin, melatonin implants or lupron on those days. I think the deslorelin and good diet will help our babies with their two most common ailments. hopefully that adrenal vaccine will work and be approved within the next few years. Sadly, we can't invent immortality.
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Post by 3kaw on Jan 11, 2011 9:03:12 GMT -5
Coming in a bit late on the convo but better late then never. I understand your frustration. Having 3 kids and various pets over the years, and feeling very much the same as you do regarding alternative heath I have had similar fights and struggles. Things I`ve learned is to watch who you say what to, and maybe not lie but dont tell everything. I tend to use doctors for what they are good for, testing and diagnosing (sometimes they get this right ) and then with that information I decide the best treatment options, usually it is not what they have to offer. My youngest is 9 and has no vaccines and the only allopathic medicine he`s ever had was for a throat infection at the age of 16months. The only reason he got it then was because we were on vacation, with no access to remedies with an 8 hour car ride ahead of us. With animals its much harder. Here (canada) vets can be more aggressive about who`s treating animals and how. Do i treat animals in my private practice (homeopathy) yes, do I tell people... no. Those I treat are family and like minded friends. I had a teacher who was targeted by the veterinarian association for treating animals, so one needs to walk a delicate line. Pick your battles. Ask the questions you need to get the information you need to make the decision that is right for you, then move on. I agree with those on the list that have said prioritize which is most important to you. Is it vaccine free? Is it the raw fed? Then see what options are available with those and decided what you can live with. Hoping you find what you are looking for.
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vkp23
Going Natural
Posts: 192
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Post by vkp23 on Jan 11, 2011 11:27:57 GMT -5
You know what this whole thread seems to be boiling down to in the long run is this "free" (even Canada is considered a free country) we are NOT free. Being PC, the media and politics use scare tactics to convince people that anyone who wants to do things their own way instead of having big brother tell them what to do are obviously insane freaks. I'll admit, for a LONG time I bought into the lie that natural home remedies and organic, people who didn't vaccinate their kids/pets and people who were anti-government were weirdo hippies. I HATED guns. Then I began to educate myself. I can't tell you how much crap I've been dealt for homeschooling and teaching my girls gun safety. I don't trust public schools and don't like what they teach. So I'll teach my girls. We have guns in the house. So IMO teaching my girls gun safety not only takes the mystery away and thus takes away the desire to investigate because they will already know what the guns are capable of, but it also means that should I ever not be able to get to a gun for protection in time maybe one of them can. Bottom line is, if some one wants a ferret that has never been vaccinated and was raised raw they should have the right to do so. It just doesn't make any since to not allow personal responsibility. I don't know about any one else, but I don't need anyone making my decisions for me. I'm an adult, and I'm more than capable of finding information and forming my own conclusion. Sorry, I'll step down from my soap box now. It just aggravates me just how much big brother controls our lives through laws and suggestion.
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Post by miamiferret2 on Jan 11, 2011 13:09:49 GMT -5
DITTO! ever watch the video of dr. suzanna gratia speaking before u.s. congress? the woman is my hero.... www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQNS_CmA1wQunfortunately, NO VET will work with me on fluffing the rabies vax for my dog and ferret. so if i don't vax the dog i will be fined. i hate the government.
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