Halbingefrau's Switching Thread/Sherrylynne

[halblingefrau]

Yeah they're really turning into the little carnivores they were born to be! We hit a plateau there for awhile but that's just because my kids said "chunks of meat, wtf? give us the whole thing!"

My husband was up late last night and said that Juno and Asher were playing tug o' war with a wing, hissing and puffing and squeaking their heads off.

New development however. Someone (or more than one) has decided litter boxes are for food, bedding is for pooping.

I busted out my dremel and I'm building a feeding den for 2 reasons: place to stash plus it is going to be put where they've been pooping which will hopefully stop that.

[sherrylynne]

I hate to say it, but it does happen. Just make sure to clean up the messes in the bedding as soon as they happen. They are likely protest pooping over the change, even if they happen to like the change, the little beggars
It's what they do. They'll get over it.

[halblingefrau]

The thing is I haven't changed the positions of their litter boxes or anything. I think Asher's use of the boxes as a dining room is more to blame. *sigh* Oh well, constant battles. The joys of ferret ownership. Smart little sods.

[halblingefrau]

Kids got some slices of cube steak last night. Asher dug in, but Loki and Juno weren't too sure. Eventually I did see them licking it. Not sure if they actually ate it or not. I gave them more this morning.

In other news, I made a feeding den out of the frame from a plastic drawer and covered it with a pillowcase. So far there has not been any stashing in the litterbox (not sure if he's stashing anywhere else). I found if I put the food in the den, stashing has become less obvious. He still stashed like crazy with the food outside the den. I think he likes that his food is hidden away now.

[sherrylynne]

It does help tremendously. Don't forget- their wild cousins would drag all their food back to their den to hide it from scavengers. So having it "prehidden" relieves some of the stress of anyone taking it on them.
With the new meats, watch and make sure they are actually chewing it, rather than just licking it. That way, you'll know what accepted with no problems, and what may require some more work.

[halblingefrau]

Everyone ate some, but Ash liked it the most. Had 1/4 Cornish hen tonight that caused some hissing and yelling over who got the wing tip. They LOOOOOOVE poultry. Going to give a bit of pork roast tomorrow before it hits the crock pot.

[sherrylynne]

It does sound good Have they had any liver/kidney yet? That will, unfortunately, likely be another hurdle
I actually had to make liver puree for almost a year before they were willing to eat it plain on their own

[halblingefrau]

Yeah they didn't eat the beef liver. It was fresh but OMG it smelled. Not rancid, just STRONG. I don't have anywhere to buy kidney from so we're sticking with liver and hearts for the most part. I wonder if they'd get used to liver if i juiced it (omg barf) and got their chicken wings coated in it. Get them used to the flavor? I dunno.

[sherrylynne]

Might be worth a shot. If not, you can always puree it, and add about a tbsp or so of heavy(whipping) cream. That's how I got mine going with it. Can you find chicken livers? They are much milder.

[halblingefrau]

Yeah I have a ton of frozen livers. I bought the beef just because i hadn't seen it before. It's in the freezer and I am not sure if I will defrost it. It was pretty gross and strong smelling. But I used to add chicken livers to their soupie and they liked it just fine. I haven't tried the heavy cream but I bet they'll LOVE that mix.

[sherrylynne]

Try it with the cream. If it's still a no-go, then just stick with the chicken livers. You can always try it again later, or even pork or turkey livers if you can find them.
Do you have any specialty pet stores around? Sometimes you can get the different livers in those, because they are also frequented by the raw feeders, so there is a demand.

[halblingefrau]

We don't really have any special stores. I have a feed store that carries commercial raw, but no organs.

So I tried a whole chicken liver with the kids tonight. Loki and Asher ate it so fast Juno didn't get more than a few licks. And they ate with their eyes closed. Not sure if that's normal or just a ferret way of going "OMG THIS IS SO GOOD".

Gave another wing tonight and they were in full on MINE mode. Each one pulling and tugging and making such a horrible ruckus of squeaks and hisses, I gave them a second whole wing. Juno ran off with it.

So it seems they are good with all poultry. So far tried chicken and cornish hen and they love both. I haven't seen any of the pork i put in there but it might have been stashed. Loki licked it but I didn't see him eat. Asher tried to stash but couldn't (i put it on a hook) but he might have succeeded.

How often do I need to give them liver/heart? I am thinking it'd be easier on me to just do a whole organ meal instead of bits with every meal.

[sherrylynne]

Wow! I'm impressed! And the closed eyes are the "OMG!!!! This is so good!!!:
Alright. General menu would be as follows:
4 days(8 meals) bone in meats(chicken wings, necks, turkey necks/ribs/wing tips, whole prey, cornish hen, duck necks/ribs/wing tips, etc)
2 days(4 meals) muscle meats(any meat with no bone)
1 meal organ meats, other meal likely bone in.
Heart is a muscle meat, not an organ meat. So are gizzards. They can generally eat the bone from any animal chicken sized or smaller.
It's time to start introducing other meats. Once they are eating them reliably, it's going to be time to graduate you

[halblingefrau]

And it doesn't matter if I feed two different types in one day? Like let's say tomorrow they'll have bone in for breakfast and liver for dinner?

I know hearts are a muscle meat, but i separate them in my mind b/c of the taurine. I have some freeze dried turkey hearts. Any way to reconstitute or should I chop up into kibble sized bits?

I'm going to keep an eye out for other kinds of meats. They did eat the cube steak so that's good, although they didn't like it much. I don't think they really ate it until they were hungry and realized I wasn't going to give them chicken.

I am going to pick up some frozen meeces this week if I can. I'd love to supplement frankenprey with whole. I don't have the freezer space to make ordering from rodent-pro economical, so the mice will have to be a treat.

[sherrylynne]

If you want to mix and match, that's fine. Just try to keep to the 8 meals a week bone in, 4 meals a week muscle(at least one of which should be heart), 1 meal liver, the other either muscle or bone in. I prefer bone in following an organ meal. Helps the stool firm back up again You can even use chicken as a base for the bone in if you prefer.
The great thing about a raw diet is the versatility. One week for bone in, my guys might get turkey necks, rabbit, quail. The next week bone is is chicken(for one group), ox tail, pork rib tail ends(some bone, some heavy cartiledge). Whole prey is bone in.
Same for the muscle meats. One week- lamb, beef cubes, pork. The next might be turkey, pork chops, chicken thigh meat. Ihave two boxes in my freezer. One box is "bone in" meats, the other is "muscle meats". Heart and liver/organ I store separately. Depending on what day it is, I just grab a couple of bags out of the appropriate boxes, and that's what they get that day Never too sure what it's going to be, and they love it that way. They get a ton of variety.
Lately, I've been using commercial raw for morning meals, though, since I've got a couple of "lazy" eaters One would rather not eat bone, given a choice(not!), and a couple of the younger ones who still don't like liver.
Fish is another bone in meal. But that one, they shouldn't have more than once a week at the most. Not only is it not a normal part of a ferret's diet, it can make them rather stinky if they have too much
I know when you are just starting out, having a set plan would be much easier. That's why it's important for you to start setting up a menu plan. Once you get to that point, it becomes easier to switch out meats based on what you've got listed for that day.
As long as you follow the general guide lines of bone/muscle/organ ratio, you are good to go
Right now, our main goal is getting them to accept other meats, and "broaden their horizons" as a result