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Post by wronka on Nov 29, 2010 22:24:11 GMT -5
So I recently switched my 2 ferrets over to raw about a week and a half ago. It ended up not being as hard as I thought it was going to be because my oldest boy (2.5 yrs old) went right for the raw turkey and it took the little girl (1.5 yrs old) about 2 days to get use to the diet. I basically made a powder out of there old kibble and used it as a topping for a few days as they got accustomed to the new diet. As of now I am still chopping up the raw into inch size pieces for them. This is where my questions come in. I have a schedule consisting of 4 days a week bone in (chicken wings or turkey necks), 2 days a week muscle (chicken gizzard and hearts), and 1 day a week organ (chicken liver). Does this schedule seem ideal? Also how long should I keep cutting up bone-in into bite size pieces before I start feeding them full parts? My second question is about feeding organs. Do I really need to feed other organs besides liver and heart? if so for what nutrients?
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Post by Heather on Nov 29, 2010 23:03:29 GMT -5
Congratulations...great stuff. You keep trying to sneak in larger and larger pieces  . That's it.... as far as getting them to eat whole meats and you to stop chopping Now you need to get 2 other proteins (you're feeding chicken and turkey so truthfully that's 2 proteins) so one other protein technically and convince them to eat it. The more different proteins that you feed the more nutrients you cover and the less you need to supplement. Some supplement with taurine, marine fish oils and pumpkin or squash if feeding frankenprey (store bought meats assembled to create a whole animal). Make sense?  ciao |
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Post by wronka on Nov 30, 2010 0:16:04 GMT -5
Ahh okay I will look for another protein source the enxt time I go to the grocery store. Also I already use a supplement that I have used ever since I got my first ferret called "Missing link" food supplement for cats. It contains the following:
Ingredients
Flax seed*, blackstrap molasses, rice bran, primary dried yeast, freeze dried beef liver, sunflower seed, dehydrated alfalfa, dried carrot, freeze dried beef bone meal, freeze dried cod fish protein concentrate, freeze dried oyster, sprouted green barley, dried kelp, lecithin, garlic, and yucca schidigera extract.
*Flax from Canada.
Guaranteed Analysis
Crude protein (min.) 20%, crude fat (min.) 28%, crude fiber (max.) 10%, moisture (max.) 10%, taurine (min. per 3/4 tsp.) 400 mcg, linoleic acid (omega 6) (min. per 3/4 tsp.) 100 mg, linolenic acid* (omega 3) (min. per 3/4 tsp.) 250 mg.
*Not recognized as an essential nutrient by the AAFCO cat food nutrient profiles.
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Post by Heather on Nov 30, 2010 0:31:28 GMT -5
I know the stuff, I used it for my dog but....flax seed can be questionable for ferrets actually my dog couldn't tolerate it either. They definitely can't use it but that doesn't mean that their gut doesn't use it...ferrets themselves derive no nutritional value from it. It may help them digest their food though. I've had a number of my furkids who are intolerant, makes them itch...more  Now, to go into the foods in that, that your ferret shouldn't have...molasses converts into pure sugar....insulima. Yeast, not a good food for your cat or your ferret either....sunflower..neither carnivore can actually make use of it. Carnivores have no use for barley either, can't process it. Garlic...is a questionable product for ferrets. For cats absolutely not. If I remember correctly the product is pricey, you'd be better spending your money elsewhere. JMO of course Usually, I look at what I need or what is missing from my furbabies diet. Generally, I use the meats to supplement...variety is your best answer. ciao |
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Post by josiesmom on Dec 9, 2010 7:19:05 GMT -5
Ahh the "Missing Link" a product that capitalizes on great marketing and instills doubts about feeding so here - use our product and everything will be A.O.K!
There is very little of that product suitable for ferrets (or cats) and since it is in a dry, processed form - you may as well save your money and simply feed from raw sources. Besides the variety you'll be offering your ferrets, the raw form will be more bioavailable and MUCH easier on your pocket book! Besides that the raw form will also promote better oral health!
Do a simple quick analysis of your own from the ferret gut perspective, keeping in mind the premise that the ingredients list is supposed to represent by volume the amounts of that product. The items listed first have the largest amount, reducing the volume to the end of the list.
Using your quoted description:
"Missing link" food supplement for cats. It contains the following:
Ingredients
1. Flax seed*: PLANT, therefore indigestible.
2. Blackstrap molasses: SUGAR, causes peaks and valleys of blood sugar, over works pancreas, contributes if not causes Insulinoma (cancer) in the Pancreas. Also molasses is known to produce gas, causing bloating,discomfort, flatulence and irritates bowels.
3. Rice bran: PLANT, therefore indigestible.
4. Primary dried yeast: converts to carbohydrate, which is a sugar (see above)
5. Freeze dried beef liver: in this product, if memory serves, has been pulverized or powdered - which is great for assimilation - but you might as well offer liver to them raw so they can benefit from the high moisture content or a slab of actual freeze dried liver so their teeth can benefit from the gentle cleaning. Beef liver is readily available - from the market, but not likely something a ferret would naturally come across very often. With the worry of "Mad Cow Disease" and the prevalence of artificial hormones and antibiotics used in the beef industry a daily intake from this liver source may NOT be such a good idea. A better alternative liver source and one more likely suited to a ferret's natural prey - would be turkey or chicken livers.
6. Sunflower seed: PLANT, therefore indigestible.
7. Dehydrated alfalfa: PLANT, therefore indigestible.
8. Dried carrot: PLANT, therefore indigestible.
9. Freeze dried beef bone meal: Another digestible product for the ferret - but again its a bovine source, same concerns as above and it isn't likely a ferret would take down a cow - so personally I'd opt for offering raw meaty bones from smaller sources and whole prey.
10. Freeze dried cod fish protein concentrate: NO real issues here as far as digestion goes, but being as it is a concentrate - what concerns are there regarding excess amounts of vitamin A? Also is it protein concentrate from a digestible protein source or mostly the scales and fins which are protein but not digestible? Again, a better alternative that would allow more normal amounts of nutrients would be simply a whole fish like a sardine, or feeder fish, bait fish, a piece of skin on salmon.
11. Freeze dried oyster: This being a salt water creature would be something the ferret's cousin an Otter might eat and Possibly a Mink but I 'd wonder about this being a natural food source for ferrets. Considering it is just about last on their list there likely isn't much Oyster in the product - so why bother?
12. Sprouted green barley: PLANT, therefore indigestible.
13. Dried kelp: PLANT, therefore indigestible.
14. Lecithin: a Fatty acid additive - most commonly from soybeans but not specified in this ingredient list - so are oils from plants indigestible for ferrets? Might be an interesting research item!
15. Garlic: PLANT, therefore indigestible.
16. Yucca schidigera extract: PLANT, therefore indigestible(?) considering that an "EXTRACT" is a product containing ALCOHOL - this should DEFINITELY not be something ingested by ferrets.
*Flax from Canada: PLANT, therefore indigestible. But this listing may simply indicate the Flax seed source for the1st ingredient.
SO looking over this list of 16 ingredients you've just paid a small fortune for to "supplement" your ferret's (or cat's) diet to provide so called "missing nutrients" we can see that there are only three actual animal source ingredients! One of these may not even be from a digestible protein source. The Lecithin source is not specified so may not be bio-available either.
From an ingredient standpoint- this product MISSES the mark for adding anything of significant value, instead the ingredients offer many more QUESTIONABLE items, at least 13 indigestible plant items and one mystery source item and three of the ingredients are actually detrimental to the ferret (molasses, yeast and extract).
Shuck out your money on real meaty raw bones or whole prey items to offer your ferrets the nutrients they need in forms their bodies can utilize! All those indigestible ingredients equals simply POOP!
IN your first post's description of your items fed, Items readily available from human grade markets I'd add chicken backs, sardines (whole, bone in - packed in water or oil.- NOT salted), cornish game hen, rabbit, eggs which will offer your ferrets a good range of edible bone/calcium sources as well as meat proteins.Whole prey items are ideal.
Personally I offer my ferrets a piece of turkey heart or chicken heart daily. My thinking is that if they killed a prey item, they'd be eating heart and organs daily. However I only offer liver occasionally mainly because it goes uneaten.
Beat the raw eggs well and completely pulverized the egg shells and beat them into the egg - mine get this egg on Sundays.
Cover your bases from all manner of animal sources and your ferrets will do best! No need for spending money on well advertised ineffective products!
Cheers,
Kim
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