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Post by woozelwoman on Jan 21, 2009 3:37:15 GMT -5
I hope this is where this thread belongs, I have wandered around the forum looking and reading and taking notes. What and informative forum for people with ferrets. You see, I don’t own any ferrets yet, I have wanted one for years, I just didn’t know anything about them. I have been doing a lot of research, I would like to get two for my self and my four daughters to enjoy. I have so many questions about how to feed them still. I have read the book ferrets for dummies, I am on three forums including this one, in my search for information. I use to raise feeder and pet mice and thought that would be a plus in owning a ferret I could grow my own food for them. I don’t want to get over whelmed. Because that can happen when raising mice. I never thought of dirt. I like the idea dirt for the mice cages, that makes so much sense, I will try that. I guess my question would be, can I feed only mice? How many would each need a day? If I only fed mice, I could feed different sizes as well. I had thought about starting with three doe’s and one buck because one buck can service quite a few doe mice. Any time I would want to go up in doe’s I would just buy another doe or doe's at the pet store then they wouldn’t be related, or keep so many females and get a new male (if ya know what I mean). One buck is plenty because of how bad they musk. We had one silk hair male that was rank, no one needs too many of them. I have a 60 gallon tank I thought I could section it off into groups with plexi glass or something. I also have a few 10 gallon tanks from when we use to raise them before. Always remember when raising mice, if you use aquariums for your mice you can never again put fish in those, because the mouse urine gets in the sealant around the inside and will kill any fish. (just a note). Now I had thought about freezing them, I thought about putting them in a homemade co2 chamber then freezing them. I could get a small chest freezer and put some in it rotating all the time. How would I freeze them properly? I could vacuum seal them, or would I use one per ziplock, or three? What would be the best way? Then I thought about chickens, my dad use to raise chickens and he knows how to incubate the eggs, so then we had thought about getting about 20 chickens and one rooster a while ago so we could have fresh eggs and such, so I could incubate eggs and have my own chicks for the ferrets to, that could be factored in with the mice. Kibble or not to kibble, that’s my question? Shouldn’t I leave kibble out for them at all times and feed them the prey twice a day? Just for a variety, or no kibble at all? What about cat treats? Or canned for a treat? Or just straight pray, with a little bit of raw? I like the idea of raw as well. We eat a lot of deer meat here, frozen and dehydrated, would it be good for a ferret? These are all ideas I want to figure out before we get any ferrets. I want a game plan. Thank you all for all the info. It is wonderful to have help getting started because I don’t know where to begin.
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Post by nwheather on Jan 21, 2009 8:13:33 GMT -5
That's cool that you have background in raising mice! I could learn more on that from you! =-) I am just starting my mouse colony. There are many people on here that can help you in detail on swtiching to raw & whole prey, how much to feed, etc. I have kibble available at all times, (Evo feline, a little Evo canine (to help cut down the richness of the feline, which can make poop a little runny...I also add in some Wysong Nurture with free range pheasant, Wysone ferret Achetype 1, Stella & Chewy's beef & chicken steaks, mixed in.) I also give them Pingford's Porrage every morning, that has some kibble mix blended in, & they also like the NV raw meadllions. 4 of mine eat mice too. You asked about how to dispatch them. I have seen a few ways listed online, & some pros & cons to them. I heard you can freeze pinkies & they will die quickly because they loose body heat so fast. Once they have fur though, I heard they die slowly, so I would not recommend it. There is a dry ice setup listed in the posts, but some say it suffocates them & I don't like that thought. Manual dispatching can be done, but my preferred method is just to allow my ferrets to do it. It is enrichment for them, & they are not like cats, they do not play with them, they kill them fast. All 4 of mine who eat mice have killed their own. I would recommend you do this in a bathtub or rubbermaid box or somewhere that is easy to clean & sanitize, sometimes there can be a lot of blood, but not always. That is just my personal opinion. Others here who breed mice can offer other ideas.
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Post by sherrylynne on Jan 21, 2009 9:17:24 GMT -5
No idea about the raising of mice here ! Mine are on a RMB and frozen whole prey diet. They get no kibbles what so ever. I generally feed the RMB twice a day, whole prey once a week. I feed them about 30 minutes before they come out for playtimes, and whatever they've not finished goes back into the cage for the day/night. If they've been little piggies, and eaten all they're meat, they get Wysong's Archetypal 1., which they love, in the cage, so they have access to food 24/7. Feeding them in cage has certainly helped keep the stashing down! For treats, mine get dehydrated salmon treats, dehydrated liver treats, or the odd bit of Ziwipeak.
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Post by woozelwoman on Jan 21, 2009 10:48:50 GMT -5
I think it is ok to feed either live or pre killed mice, either is fine in my eyes. Yet I do think it would be a treat for them to get to kill their own some to. Really though, I had to kill feeder mice before, when you put them in the chamber they just get sleepy and go to sleep, then they don’t wake up. It really isn’t so bad, not as bad as it could be. I wouldn’t want to freeze them to death though. I just worry about how the mice like to take over with how they breed, if you don’t be careful you can be over run with them in such a short amount of time. If they aren’t fed right or split up they will eat each other, and quickly to. Esp. a nursing doe needs the correct nutrition or she will eat her young to get it. I have also had doe’s eat just a few out of the litter till she has an amount she can handle when they birth too many. I had a hamster once that had 15 pups and they all lived. I don’t care much for the hamsters though they can be sassy, my 9 year old almost got the tip of her finger bit off by one, it wasn’t good. Now she is afraid of all hamsters. It ruined her love of them. I have been nipped more times than I want to mention by the feeder mice, the nipps aren’t so bad though. I feel freezing is a good idea because then you can make sure you won’t get over run with mice, you can save the mice for later use as well. I want to have a little chest freezer just for the ferret food. I thought I could feed them live mice and frozen ones, with a variety of sizes. I just wanted an idea of how many breeders to start out with. Their gestation is 21 days, if the doe is bred right after the pups are born, she will have another litter in 21 days. Sometimes that is hard to do because most bucks will eat the young. Not all, but most. We had a coal black buck named Dusty that was awesome a few years ago, he was so friendly, he didn‘t stink bad at all, (rare), he never ate babies, we could leave him in with Gypsy (a white silk coat doe) and they could just have litter after litter, after litter. He only lived a little over two years though. That was when we only had that pair. They actually threw a silver baby, it was so pretty. We sold and gave away so many pet mice from those two. Yea, I think it is best to raise just the white feeder mice, it’s hard to feed the pretty ones. LOL My 13, 6, and 3 year olds will want to keep them all as pets if they are pretty. LoL ;D
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Post by spiritualtramp on Jan 21, 2009 11:35:48 GMT -5
While whole prey like mice, at varying ages, can fulfill much of their diet, I wouldn't limit yourself (or your future ferrets) to just mice! There is a great big world of flavor out there, and so many meats that they can love. If you have access to venison, you can probably easily find other game meats, like quail and rabbit! And then you can also feed raw meaty bones for a bit of 'flavor.' When done properly, there'd be no need to even leave kibble available, and many times even when people elect to do so, the ferrets will wait for their raw meals and leave the kibble alone.
My kids are on a rmbs diet, with occasional game meats and commercial raw (Nature's Variety, Stella & Chewy's, etc.) There are so many options for your specific needs and the great thing is, you have total control! I applaud you for looking into and researching ferrets and their needs before jumping into ownership, that is truly admirable and it looks like you will be very prepared when you do decide to bring some home. Keep poking around, asking questions, and check out the whole prey section for more on feeder mice (and other whole prey...!)
Good luck with your colony!
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Post by woozelwoman on Jan 21, 2009 14:20:49 GMT -5
I totally agree, there are so many meats out there, like rabbits for instance, squirrel maybe, I’m not sure? But it is a meat so why not. lol That is the one thing I like is there are so many options, yet being able to raise the mice makes me feel a little bit better about knowing where their food source comes from. If I raise their food, whether it be rabbits, mice or chicks, I would know exactly what went into it, I can’t say that about food that comes in a can or a bag. That is one big reason this forum is so important to beginners like myself. My husband is a hunter from way back, he lives to hunt and for every single hunting season. So there is always options for different meats to be added to their diet. Also with the raw diet as well. I could set down and plan diets each month for my fur babies with all sorts, and types of meats choices. Thanks to all of you the ferrets that live in my home will not be fed a boring cat food diet. I know a girl who has a ferret and all it has eaten for the past 8 years is cat food, and the cheapest cat food at that. After reading and all the notes I have taken, I feel so bad for that ferret to be so deprived. I want to be a better ferret mommy than that. Who knows, if I learn a lot about natural foods, then maybe I will be able to switch all our dogs to and never have to buy dog food or cat food again. That is a huge plus. Thank you. ;D
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Post by sherrylynne on Jan 21, 2009 19:24:30 GMT -5
Getting your dogs and cats, as well as your ferts, on a natural diet is a great idea! My kitties are still in the transition process to raw(stubborn little brats ), and there is just as much of a difference in them as I saw in the ferrets at the beginning!
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Post by spiritualtramp on Jan 21, 2009 19:36:54 GMT -5
I'm with you there, switching all your pets to raw can only benefit them! Dogs are generally easier to switch but like Sherry noted, cats are tricky. You can certainly learn a lot here, and I'm sure others have links to dog and/or cat specific natural diet forums too, to better your learning if you decide to switch them as well.
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Post by woozelwoman on Jan 21, 2009 22:17:23 GMT -5
Kitty is working on her transition right now, lol she is setting in front of my kitchen sink where a little field mouse keeps jumping out of my cabinet onto the floor. I think it is the one she had two nights ago and let escape from her. She is such an awesome mouser, she just won't eat them. She kills them by either beating them to death, or scaring them to death, either way she will not eat them, at all, no part of them, she will just lay them up in front of our bedroom door to give my husband when he gets up for work. I told my husband that if we had a ferret that mouse wouldn't have had a chance, they would have shredded the mouse at first sight. I don’t have the first idea how to switch her to raw, she won’t even eat table scraps. She will only eat one kind of cat food to, I have tried all others. Oh, I talked to a breeder the other day who feeds her ferrets mice and chicks, I like that it’s a good start. I would like for the ferrets we get to already be on raw or pray from the start. May make the raw/pray change easier.
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Post by Heather on Jan 22, 2009 1:17:41 GMT -5
You've got the right idea. Just popping in rather late in this whole discussion. You can feed entirely raw, I've not allowed kibbles into my house in over 10 yrs except when someone dumps off a furbaby here. The last batch of kibbles got fed to the mice...they wouldn't eat it ...says a lot about kibbles All the ferrets, cats and dog eat entirely natural and raw diets. No kibbles, no vaccinations are done here. I raise my own mice, a friend raises rats (for her snakes) I buy her surplus. I have a supplier for whole rabbits. I also feed chicken (who doesn't except for those that have discovered their furbabies are sensitive) quail, whole dressed rabbit, lamb, ground meats, emu, beef, turkey and duck (oh I feed venison and elk too when it's in season). If it's meat....it can be fed. I wouldn't feed only mice. There aren't enough variety to cover all your bases nutritionally. Feeding various ages is indeed a must but you also need to cover other mineral and dietary short comings. The more variety the less you have to worry about supplementing. I don't supplement, except to use marine fish oil to cover the huge amount of fats that ferrets require nutritionally. How you choose to feed your mice is a personal thing. I allow my guys to kill their own. I've almost got enough mice to give my guys a feed about every other week. I'm hoping to produce enough to allow my guys to feed at least once a week. With 16 furbabies that's a lot of mice though. Kitty's are cruel hunters compared to ferrets. I think there is a reason why a group of ferrets are called a business. They're all business when it comes to hunting . It's all over in a minute. I used to allow my guys to hunt rats too, until they botched a hunt and the rat that I got was too big for them to make a clean kill. Now they eat the rats (no matter what size) frozen. That way I don't feel guilty about the kill. Mice are always killed in the bathtub. I usually let the guys hunt in pairs and each pair gets to kill the whole group that has been growing up in the bachelor pad. After they've had their hunt then they share their kills with the rest of their brethren as a night snack. Ferret kits are an easy switch but all ages are doable... I switched a 9 yr old furchild this summer. She caused me endless amounts of problems with the switch, had me questioning my sanity more than once but she now thinks nothing about helping herself to whatever is being offered for the day. Switching your kitty, though no easy task is entirely doable to. I switched my 12 yr old kibble addicted siamese. It took me about 6 months but I got there and now the old fart is 21 yrs and still going strong. Pm me is you're interested in some assist in getting your kitty to eat something other than that body drying kibble. It's not like feeding ferrets where you can become really personally involved. Kitty's have their own ideas on how it should be done Good luck, I think you're doing great and you're well on your way to figuring out how to get your furbaby to eat a healthy diet ciao
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