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Post by animalsgetrevenge on Jul 21, 2008 19:48:37 GMT -5
Since I am transitioning to raw for the fuzzies I am interesting in getting my 18lb. Boston mix and by man's chihuahua off of kibble too.
Does anyone have any links or book suggestions to help me? Any suggestions of your own? I am looking for a raw diet, not cooked. Either raw meats or meat plus veggies, preferably no cooking or grains unless you can convince me otherwise!
Thanks beautifuls!
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Post by weloveourweasels on Jul 21, 2008 20:31:44 GMT -5
When I ordered a free sample from Wysong They sent me 2 different cat foods 2 different dog foods the 2 ferret foods and a canine feline kind called nuture free range with pheasent. They included with the order a guide called how to applogize to your pets and a few other little brochures everything was free. It is very important that when feeding raw you don't cook anything and for dogs and cats you have to include vegetables and fruits so they get the extra nurtrients they need. Just use the contact us button to e-mail them and tell them how many animals you have and what kind. www.wysong.net/
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Post by tsslilsis on Jul 21, 2008 20:59:18 GMT -5
Actually......... Dogs and cats are carnivores.. So they shouldn't have fruit or vegetables. Fruit is just un-needed sugar, and they can't digest fruit or vegetables so there is no point. I suggest that you join www.dogster.com they've got a raw forum on there and the people are Extremely informative. We feed our dogs half raw. It is not as costly as one would think, you just have to know where to look. Local farms and slaughter houses are the best place to start! If you have questions, please, contact me or my sister (tss). We've been feeding raw since October 2005. -~Ketlin
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Post by weloveourweasels on Jul 21, 2008 21:25:04 GMT -5
Dogs are carnivores Yes, dogs are carnivores. There are many degrees to carnivores. They are not a “true” carnivore like a cat but more a secondary carnivore. They need vegetables as well as meat to provide the correct metabolism and pH of body fluids. Meat provides protein in order to rebuild muscle tissue (heart, lungs, joints, ligaments, tendons, throat, etc.) and to keep the immune system going. Protein or more importantly amino acids provide a variety of jobs within the body. Meat is the best source of protein. Meat also provides essential fatty acids, vitamins ( b-complex, A, E, D, etc.), minerals (Mg, Zn, Cu, Chr, Se, etc), enzymes, co-enzymes, co-factors, etc. Vegetables also provide protein, vitamins, minerals, essential fatty acids, fiber, etc. Cats can eat more meat then dogs because they have a different body pH requirement. There are other anatomical differences too. The bottom line is dogs and cats are carnivores and they need meat in order to survive and feel well. www.pets4life.com/index.php?p=research/faqsNutrition There are a great quantity of commercial foods and treats marketed for dogs, and not all are recommended as part of a balanced, healthy diet.There is some debate as to whether domestic dogs should be classified as omnivores or carnivores, by diet. The classification in the Order Carnivora does not necessarily mean that a dog's diet must be restricted to meat; unlike an obligate carnivore, such as the cat family with its shorter small intestine, a dog is neither dependent on meat-specific protein nor a very high level of protein in order to fulfill its basic dietary requirements. Dogs are able to healthily digest a variety of foods including vegetables and grains, and in fact dogs can consume a large proportion of these in their diet. Wild canines not only eat available plants to obtain essential amino acids, but also obtain nutrients from vegetable matter from the stomach and intestinal contents of their herbivorous prey, which they usually consume. Domestic dogs can survive healthily on a reasonable and carefully designed vegetarian diet, particularly if eggs and milk products are included. Some sources suggest that a dog fed on a strict vegetarian diet without L-carnitine may develop dilated cardiomyopathy,[58] however, L-carnitine is found in many nuts, seeds, beans, vegetables, fruits and whole grains. In the wild, dogs can survive on a vegetarian diet when animal prey is not available. Observation of extremely stressful conditions such as the Iditarod Trail Sled Dog Race, and scientific studies of similar conditions has shown that high-protein (approximately 40%) diets including meat help prevent damage to muscle tissue in dogs and some other mammals. This level of protein corresponds to the percentage of protein found in the wild dog's diet when prey is abundant; higher levels of protein seem to confer no added benefit. Dogs frequently eat grass, which is a harmless activity. Explanations abound, but rationales such as that it neutralizes acid, or that dogs eat grass to induce vomiting to remove unwanted substances from their stomachs,[59] are at best educated guesses. Dogs do vomit more readily than humans, as part of their typical feeding behavior of gulping down food then regurgitating indigestible material such as bones and fur. This behavior is typical of pack feeding in the wild, where the most important thing is to get as much of the kill as possible before others consume it all. Individual domestic dogs, however, may be very "picky" eaters, in the absence of this social pressure. Dogs may also appear to eat grass when they are just running the blades through their mouth to gather information. Their sense of smell and taste may act together to detect if other animals have walked through their area or urinated on the grass. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DogI didn't waist my time searching on anything for cats since you don't have any cats.
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Post by weloveourweasels on Jul 21, 2008 21:32:38 GMT -5
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Post by Forum Administrator on Jul 22, 2008 6:08:35 GMT -5
Administrator's Note:The topic of whether or not dogs can/should eat veggies is highly debated. Dogs are classified as carnivores but the debate rages back and forth on whether or not they should be classified as omnivores. As weloveourweasels mentioned, they arent as strict of a carnivore as a cat or ferret (who are obligate carnivores). From my own research on the topic I feel that dogs CAN eat veggies, but they really SHOULDNT eat them. And as for the issue of dogs/wolves eating the stomach contents of their prey (and being considered an omnivore), that is addressed below in these links: rawfed.com/myths/stomachcontents.htmlrawfed.com/myths/omnivores.html Now, for getting your doggies onto raw I would recommend checking out the dogster raw forum (just google it) like tsslilsis suggested (I troll on there all the time). If you'd like my personal assistance in getting your puppers onto raw, feel free to simply ask questions (number them to make it easier on me) and I'll be happy to answer. I have limited experience with PERSONALLY putting dogs on raw diets, but I am currently putting my father's golden retriever onto raw and Im working to persuade my mom to put her shiba inu/lab onto raw foods as well. Small breed dogs often suffer the most from severe peridontal disease. This is because they have small jaws and overcrowded/oversized teeth. Out of all the breeds of dogs IMO small breed dogs need a natural diet the most! See here: rawfed.com/myths/toybreeds.htmlI am moving this post to the subforums here in the Odds and Ends section (the natural diet for dogs and cats section)
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Post by Forum Administrator on Jul 22, 2008 6:15:53 GMT -5
It is very important that when feeding raw you don't cook anything and for dogs and cats you have to include vegetables and fruits so they get the extra nurtrients they need. Im afraid I disagree. Like ferrets, cats are obligate carnivores and they have NO need for fruits and veggies. They can digest them ie break them down (somewhat) but they derive no nutritional benefit from them and in some cases these unatural ingredients can cause issues in cats. As for the issue of dogs and veggies, like I mention above, its a hotly debated topic. Personally I feel that dogs DO NOT need veggies.
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Post by animalsgetrevenge on Jul 24, 2008 19:13:29 GMT -5
Thanks for all the help guys!
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Post by jennifer5799 on Jul 29, 2008 12:21:37 GMT -5
I'm way late on this and you've got some good info, but I thought I'd recommend a couple groups and books. The yahoo group RAW_lite is WONDERFUL! Very knowledgeable and there are people on there from all walks of life, so they are able to help with almost any problem - they're also very laid back and aren't going to scream at you if you do something wrong, The book Raw Dog Food: Make It Easy for You and Your Dog by Carina Beth Macdonald is EXCELLENT - very simple and to the point - in fact, I would recommend it for anyone feeding raw period, even though it mostly talks about dogs. It really shows how simple raw feeding can be. There's another book I liked, too, but I can't think of it at the moment... Hope this helps! ~Jenn
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