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Post by katt on Jan 15, 2011 5:41:03 GMT -5
They are coming along nicely! I use a wooden chopping board with my Ulu. It is really what they are meant to be sued on so I can see glass dulling it. Mine was dull when I got it off of CL and I have never sharpened it haha it works well enough, though I would still like to sharpen it at some point! Keep giving them the bone - you are correct it will take a little while and some practice for them to build up that strength. Also, have you tried giving them any organ meat, like liver and kidney yet? And hearts? I can find chicken liver, beef liver, chicken/beef hearts, and pork kidney here. Perhaps you can find something similar there. You want the liver to be 50% of the organ meat, so you will also want to find some other sources of organ If you can. Have you had a chance to look for frozen rodents in the pet store? Now would be a good time to start adding in chopped pinkies (and other protein sources) as they are eating chunks anyways. I find that when they are eating things in chunks it is much easier to slowly mix in more and more proteins. Try adding in bits of turkey, beef, pork, rabbit, mouse/rat pinky, etc to get them used to the taste of different meats. Let me know how it goes or, as always, if you have questions!
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Post by Jackie on Jan 16, 2011 12:10:09 GMT -5
They are coming along nicely! I use a wooden chopping board with my Ulu. It is really what they are meant to be sued on so I can see glass dulling it. Mine was dull when I got it off of CL and I have never sharpened it haha it works well enough, though I would still like to sharpen it at some point! Keep giving them the bone - you are correct it will take a little while and some practice for them to build up that strength. Also, have you tried giving them any organ meat, like liver and kidney yet? And hearts? I can find chicken liver, beef liver, chicken/beef hearts, and pork kidney here. Perhaps you can find something similar there. You want the liver to be 50% of the organ meat, so you will also want to find some other sources of organ If you can. Have you had a chance to look for frozen rodents in the pet store? Now would be a good time to start adding in chopped pinkies (and other protein sources) as they are eating chunks anyways. I find that when they are eating things in chunks it is much easier to slowly mix in more and more proteins. Try adding in bits of turkey, beef, pork, rabbit, mouse/rat pinky, etc to get them used to the taste of different meats. Let me know how it goes or, as always, if you have questions! So the girls got chicken wing yesterday. They seem to be doing well. They are chewing on the chunks and I hear them crunching on the small bone chunks! They are getting the rest of the wing today so I'll update you on how that is going. I had a question about the wings, though. At what point should I start offering the wing less chopped or whole? I haven't tried any organ meats alone (i.e. not in soup form with other things mixed in. I have some gizzards, hearts, and liver at the moment. I'm still looking for a steady source of hearts. Should I try like, liver soup, and see how they like it? So for the organ portion of their diet, they need liver, heart, and one other organ, right? Do gizzards fill that place? As for pinkies, I haven't had the chance to look into those yet *marks that on to do list* I am going to mix in some ground turkey and ground beef today and/or tomorrow so we'll see how they do with the ground meats. Right now, all I have is chicken, turkey, beef, and pork. I'm hoping to find a good ethnic market soon to get some more variety, but I'll have to wait until the next paycheck.
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Post by katt on Jan 17, 2011 2:58:34 GMT -5
Yay! Go ahead and start letting the bone chunks be slightly bigger, and the meat chunks bigger on the bone as well. Move them up a little each meal. If they balk, keep it the same for a few meals until they eat that size without too much of an issue, then start increasing again. See how they like organs whole. They might really like liver. If they don't go for it, then mix it in with their meat chunks just a little bit (then add more the next time). If they STILL don't go for it try the soupies and work backwards to whole. Some meats you can look for to add into the diet (there are others, this is just what I can think of atm): turkey, chicken, beef, pork, Cornish game hen, rabbit, buffalo, venison, lamb (this is a REALLY good one to get them used to in case they get sick and need a gentle food), duck (great for fattening them), goose, fish (fish oil, and small amounts of whole fish such as tuna - caned in Water with no salt - mackerel, small freshwater fish and TINY amounts of halibut and salmon), pheasant, quail, rabbit, rat, mouse, hamster, guinea pig, moose, kangaroo... Check around for stores nearby or online as well that might carry commercial raw. You can get some meats you might not be able to get otherwise that way and they often have bone and organs already ground in. It adds some nice variety to the diet if you can find it.
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Post by katt on Jan 17, 2011 3:05:36 GMT -5
PS sorry, Gizzards and hearts are considered muscle meats. Organs consist of things that produce hormones, like the kidneys, liver, spleen, etc. I have a hard time finding anything but liver and kidney. You want to try and find a variety of sources if you can too like chicken liver and beef liver and pork liver.
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Post by katt on Jan 19, 2011 5:47:38 GMT -5
Just a check in for updates. How are they coming on the bigger chunks, and the bones?
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Post by Jackie on Jan 19, 2011 10:11:09 GMT -5
They are doing good on the chunks. I think that the I went a bit too big on the chunks, so I'm making them smaller for today. They didn't touch the liver chunks.... So I'm going to add some small chunks with their next soupy.
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Post by katt on Jan 19, 2011 12:46:38 GMT -5
Sounds like a good plan. Just keep pushing their limits to the next step. Just make the chunks even a teeny bit bigger each meal and it'll start to add up. Have you tried adding other meats at all yet?
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Post by Jackie on Jan 19, 2011 13:44:18 GMT -5
At this point they eat: pork chunks, chicken wing chunks, chicken breast chunks, and chunky ground beef soup. I still have to try ground turkey, hearts and gizzards. I'll probably be making a freeze dried soup and put in the liver chunks and maybe some gizzard chunks.
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Post by katt on Jan 19, 2011 14:02:37 GMT -5
Ok so then now is the time to start looking around for more variety to start adding. See if you can find some beef or pork liver and also another organ like kidney or spleen. Now that they are crunching bones I bet they'll take to some pinkies well if you can find them and it might be worth trying some small crushed pieces of turkey neck.
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Post by Jackie on Jan 21, 2011 1:38:17 GMT -5
Okay so update:
The girls got chicken chunks for breakast but they didn't touch much of them. They got beef/pork/chicken/liver soup for dinner. They finished all of it off, so I made some ground turkey mush, and Pixie really enjoyed it. I think Trixie was just full. I put the remaining soup and a piece of turkey neck in their bowl for the night. In the morning I have some liver defrosting and some pulverized turkey neck.
I have a LOT of turkey. I got a 20 lb turkey, so I'm going to try the wings, ribs, and maybe spine soon. Hopefully they like turkey!
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Post by katt on Jan 22, 2011 12:18:42 GMT -5
Okay so update: The girls got chicken chunks for breakast but they didn't touch much of them. They got beef/pork/chicken/liver soup for dinner. They finished all of it off, so I made some ground turkey mush, and Pixie really enjoyed it. I think Trixie was just full. I put the remaining soup and a piece of turkey neck in their bowl for the night. In the morning I have some liver defrosting and some pulverized turkey neck. I have a LOT of turkey. I got a 20 lb turkey, so I'm going to try the wings, ribs, and maybe spine soon. Hopefully they like turkey! They may be getting a little tired of the chicken. Maybe try holding off for a few meals and giving other stuff. Try some pulverized Turkey neck, and even a whole (well, whole chunks lol) turkey neck and see how they like that and how they handle the bone.
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Post by Jackie on Jan 22, 2011 13:30:39 GMT -5
PIXIE ATE LIVER CHUNKS LAST NIGHT!
I was giviing the girls some ground turkey soup to get them used to the taste, and I threw in some small liver chunks (maybe 8? ). PIXIE ATE THEM ALL! Trixie didn't want anything to do with them, so that still needs to be worked on, but Pixie seemed to enjoy them a lot.
On the downside, they completely ignored the turkey neck. They were cut to a similar size as the chicken wings (maybe a bit bigger?) but they had a LOT of bone marrow that I thought would get them interested. Nope. They didn't touch them one bit. I'm giving them chicken wings today, just to make sure they are getting some boned meats. I'm going to up the size on those pieces, too.
Once they are both eating the ground turkey with no problems, I'm going to start introducing the turkey neck (and other turkey chunks). Trixie doesn't seem to like turkey too much, but hopefully she'll get used to it.
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Post by katt on Jan 23, 2011 7:11:06 GMT -5
Yaaay! Good girl! Good. Trixie will get there. Maybe try some liver soupies and see if that helps her. Just keep trying, and cut them a little smaller if you can. Getting them to eat more turkey chunks boneless will help with that too. Start with some small pieces of turkey mixed into their chicken and see how they like that. I am sure she will. Keep it up!
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Post by Jackie on Jan 23, 2011 21:42:49 GMT -5
So they finished an entire chicken wing yesterday (minus a piece or two they decided to make into jerky).
I thought I'd try the liver agian today. So I made a bowl of small chicken breast chunks and liver chunks, covered it in some oil, and sprinkled a bit of freeze dried duck to get them interested in the stuff. Well, after the girls were done playing and had built up an appetite, they decided to come check out what was in the food bowl. Pixie liked every piece of chicken breast clean of the oil and duck, but didn't even nibble on them. She ate several pieces of liver, which I am really happy about, but I have no clue why they ignored the chicken breast. Trixie is definitely hungry, because she returned to the food bowl 3-4 times and licked up the juices. I know they would eat a chicken wing if I offered it, so I don't think they are sick of chicken.
Is it too bland for them? Do they just not like chicken breast? They will eat it fine if it's in a soup form, so I don't really know. I'm defrosting some chicken thighs (bone-in) and I guess I'll see how they like those chunks.
Also, would it be okay to feed a bone in meal once a day? My girls really love chicken wings, and I'm optimistic they will enjoy other wings/boned meats. I could do bone-in every morning (or night) and on one day of the week, just give 2 boned meals, totaling 8 boned meals a week.
I might just blend up the left over chicken breast and liver with some beef, taurine, and eggshell and offer them some soup.
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Post by katt on Jan 24, 2011 5:52:36 GMT -5
If you give them ONLY chicken breast, with nothing else, will they eat it? It could be that if you mix it with something they will only eat what they like Best, and then wait for more of that to appear. I know with one of my other mentee's her Rufus does best with one kind of meat at a time, otherwise he will only eat his favorites and leave the rest. It is possible it is too bland - the reason it makes the best starter for switching. lol
As for feeding bone everyday, just consider this - the bone should be 10% of their diet. A chicken wing is roughly 30-70% bone (depending on the wing and if it is the entire wing with some meat from the shoulder bone) but probably 50% on average. IF you can feed bone-in meat and keep it down to 10% bone, then sure! But that is going to mean using just a piece in each bone-meal. What I would recommend trying as well if you like, is to alternate days. Do one meal with bones most days, but definitely be sure to have some days with no bones. Maybe set up like a 2 day on one day off schedule or something like that.
Have you tied offering them any raw egg? Try drizzling a little over their meats and see how they like it. If they like it, it is a great food to give them mixed in with their meats (or on it's onw if they Really like it) here and there. Keep trying with the liver! Any luck finding other organ sources near you by chance?
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