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Post by katt on Aug 17, 2010 4:19:01 GMT -5
So this is what I have so far: 10 gallon tank: 1 black male (Cosmo), 2 females, one albino (Evee) one brown (Shadow) 10 gallon tank: empty for future babies *crosses fingers* Med/Large Critter Keeper: Empty for male(s) when babies are born
I put Cosmo in the night of August 4th and all seemed to go well. He appeared to be having trouble catching the females who squeaked at him and ran away. lol Anyways, I checked in the morning and both females had plugs so I am hoping they were in season that night. I think that they are both pregnant, but t is hard to tell at this point. So far the three seem to be getting along. The food is disappearing faster too so I hope that means the females are eating for more than one rather than just getting fat. lol They both have little bellies, but nothing overly big so it could be a little chub, or it could be babies. We shall see. If they were successfully impregnated the first night, roughly when should I expect babies? Their gestation period is typically 3-4 weeks right, so sometime in about 2 weeks or so?
When the babies are born, what is the best course of action? I am under the impression that, this being their first litter, the babies will probably be eaten no matter what I do. If I see them being eaten, should I remove them (I intend to use some pinkies for my bf's baby corn snake to eat) or will that make the mouse more likely to eat the next litter? I know they are more likely to eat the babies if they are stressed out before hand, and that change can lead to stress. Will removing the male a little before babies encourage mom to eat the babies? I want to give them a break so I continue to get big fat healthy babies, but I prefer the babies to not be eaten if possible. Would removing the male make her feel (by having 1 less helper around) less able to care for the babies and more likely to eat them?
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Post by Heather on Aug 17, 2010 11:00:56 GMT -5
I found that leaving mom alone for a couple of days resulted in less munching of the young. My males live with the females 24/7. The other day, I found one of my males playing nursemaid (this doesn't appear uncommon) I've had greater issue with other females eating the litter before theirs is born. Generally, your going to find at some point a whole litters will disappear. I used to get stressed about it but sometimes you will find something simple like one of the nursemaid mice are doing all the eating. I had one box of mice where the babies were being eaten all the time. It turned out that one of the females was munching them....she was at it consistently....she became ferret food. Everything was fine after that. ciao
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Post by katt on Aug 17, 2010 14:26:15 GMT -5
Well I wanted to take the male out so that the female would not get pregnant immediately and be pregnant with batch 2 while nursing batch 1. That puts more strain on her little body and (so I have heard) can result in smaller, less healthy babies than if Mom is given a break. I am hoping both females are in heat so that they both have their babies at around the same time.
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Post by Heather on Aug 17, 2010 15:07:50 GMT -5
You're right ciao
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Post by katt on Aug 17, 2010 21:28:15 GMT -5
But will removing the male right before/around the time of birth stress her out more than it will help?
Also, how can I best check on the babies without stressing mommy mouse and making her eat them?
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Post by Heather on Aug 17, 2010 22:24:11 GMT -5
Try lifting the male, long before the wigglies are born. She won't even notice. Don't check on the little ones. Surprise yourself. What you don't know is missing won't be missed . It sounds cruel but chances are, all she will do is cull what wouldn't have made it in the first place. If you mess with them she could very well cull the whole litter. I don't bother with them at all other than to feed and water (doing exactly what I always do) when they're going to give birth. You will hear them when they're born and just keep a distant eye on them. If you want to grab a couple for food wait a couple of days (they'll still be hairless) and grab a couple. Try not to touch all of them and she should allow them to live, even if you do steal a couple. ciao
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Post by katt on Aug 18, 2010 12:33:21 GMT -5
Hmmmm ok. When after the babies are born can I put the male back in? And when can I start touching babies without taking them? Like to check genders and such. I have 2 separate empty tanks that I will move the males and females to when they are old enough to wean. I will let them get a little bigger, then it will be dinner time for Koda. Once I get more going I will taker babies for snake food. For now I am going to stick with one set of breeders because that is all I have space for, and that is all that I can handle the odor of - and that just barely. lmao When the females are getting tapped, I will pick two new females (daughters) and buy a new male. At least that is the plan right now, things could change. We will see if I can even manage to get babies that don't get eaten. lol
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Post by goingpostal on Aug 18, 2010 14:14:14 GMT -5
Generally I leave new babies alone at least a couple days, occansionally I have to clean around them, I also don't see any point in checking on them too early because either they will eat them or not, there's nothing I can do about it. Less stress=less chance of killing pinkies. I take out the male when the females are fat enough to be dropping babies within a few days, I let them raise that litter plus a 10 day break before re-breeding but you can reintro male whenever. Mine usually have 10-16 nice fat babies that make it to adulthood, if I was feeding off pinkies I would breed back to back to produce more.
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Post by katt on Aug 19, 2010 15:04:51 GMT -5
Thanks! that is very helpful info. I want pinkies and adult mice. Right now I want to get some adults going first before starting pinkies. Right now Koda needs food more as adult mice are more expensive than f/t pinkies. The corn snake (Pluto) is growing fast and probably able to take fuzzies soon, after which point feeding live will not be an option any more anyways. (I don't feed live past the size of fuzzies to snakes).
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Post by goingpostal on Aug 19, 2010 21:19:43 GMT -5
Since you plan to hold back a couple females out of this litter make sure you handle them a lot so they aren't as jumpy, I've been slacking due to lack of time on socializing mine lately and you can tell.
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Post by katt on Aug 20, 2010 15:17:05 GMT -5
Yeah, my brown female (Shadow) was suuuper mellow and friendly when I brought her home and I really liked it. Then I got busy/distracted and wasn't handling her as much and now she runs. I am afraid of stressing her out too much or hurting her atm as she is very obviously pregnant (babies soon?) but after I think I'll have to start handling them again.
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Post by katt on Aug 23, 2010 3:36:24 GMT -5
Shadow is about ready to pop! Eevee is either not as far along, or not carrying as many babies, but is def pregnant also. Or just very fat, bu I doubt it. lol I am afraid if Shadow has her babies first, then Eevee has hers later, then the younger babies will be eaten since they seem "small and sickly" compared to the older babies. I read that happens a lot... I guess the first litter of babies for each will be pretty likely to be eaten regardless though, so we will see...
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Post by Heather on Aug 23, 2010 12:58:35 GMT -5
It may not happen. I've had 3 or 4 litters of mice at one time, with days and sometime a week or more in between with mothers all sharing nursing duties. The problem that often occurs is when the older kits shove away the newer babies so they can nurse. I find that the mothers usually birth their little ones in separate corners in nests that they've build in my tim hortons disposable tea cups ciao
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Post by katt on Aug 26, 2010 2:38:29 GMT -5
Ok so I need help. Shadow (brown female) had her babies, and Eve (albino female) is about ready to pop. Because it is their first litter, I figured I would leave the male in for the litter so the moms felt that had more help while getting used to the whole mom thing, then next litter I would take him out before babies came and give them both a break and give them breaks in between from there on out. I didn't say anything to my roommate though (I should have! )( and she saw the babies and interfered!!!! I was really angry for multiple reasons. She tends to interfere in my animal care taking a lot (she works at a pet store and is one of those ppl who thinks she knows everything about animals and will NEVER listen if you try to show her she is wrong, but is quick to point out things you are doing wrong - which is usually incorrect on her part. Like after I switched Koda she snuck kibble into his cage...). Anyways, she went in and, thinking the male would eat the babies, took him out! AND she obviously was fishing around in the cage (he is quick and elusive) and moving/lifting things because she told me that she counted 5 babies. WHY WOULD YOU MESS WITH THEM?!?!?!?!??! Like seriously?! Leave them alone so Mom does not eat them! She knows better. Anyways, I didn't want to disturb Mom more, so I just kept the male out. Done is done. However, because he was in there when the babies came (Mon night, Tues morning I think), I imagine that he re-impregnated her right away since they go into heat right away again. The 2 females were pretty close on pregnancy dates, and I want to keep them kind of lined up (or is it better to stagger them so both females can care for one litter at a time - thought just occurred to me lol ). Should I put the male back in so that when the albino female pops she can get pregnant again too and they will still be close to lined up? OR Is it best not to since they are not exactly lined up and the white female might eat her babies since they look smaller.........? I just don't know where to go next I guess. At what age can I start to check on and inspect the babies? And at what age can I start sexing? What age to wean? I read this all somewhere...*runs off to google*
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Post by katt on Aug 26, 2010 11:36:03 GMT -5
ko.cwru.edu/services/musfrming.htmlPer that site, I can check on babies now since it has been more than a day (*resits rushing off to look*), can see nipples at 2 weeks, and wean at 3-4 weeks...sound ok?
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