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Post by spiritualtramp on Jan 28, 2009 11:44:05 GMT -5
Wow that's great news for the cats!!! I'm very happy that you're switching them all at once. It only makes sense!
Keeping Charlotte and Jane on ground and Dorian catches up is a good idea, that'll reduce the stress of trying to feed them separately. I had problems with my rmb kids being lazy and eating the ground meals I prepared for my two who weren't quite there yet, so I ended up having to do separate feedings and that was a bit of a hassle. So I think it's totally fine to keep them back until Dorian catches up.
However, I'd recommend adding some calcium and supplements to their ground until you can move them along. Calcium is the easy one - you can either get bonemeal from a butcher (byproduct of using a bonesaw, and sometimes they will give it away for free) or you can crush up some eggshells into a powder. Then sprinkle a few pinches onto ground foods and mix in.
It also might be worthwhile to vary the kinds of meats offered to get them acquainted to other flavors. Commonly found ground meats are chicken, turkey, beef, and lamb. Beef was the hardest for my kids to accept, and they actually took to it better by getting used to veal first. So you can start adding some other ground meats to their meals to keep them at least challenged, and also for variety.
How much water is Dorian getting in his kibble? Are you mushing the kibble up into a paste or letting him eat it just softened?
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Post by dearambellina on Jan 29, 2009 21:44:50 GMT -5
I haven't been specifically measuring how much water goes into it, but he's up to 6 handfuls of water Before now there hadn't been enough water to mash it to paste, but from here on out I'll be able to mash it. I've been saving up eggshells specifically for that, so I have a ton of eggshells to crush. What do you use to crush them to powder?
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Post by spiritualtramp on Jan 30, 2009 20:07:30 GMT -5
Since I don't have a mortar and pestle (who does, really!?) I use the wooden end of my knife sharpener, and a metal dish. You could also probably use a spoon or something but I found the end of the knife sharpener, since it's flat, was able to grind the eggshells easier. Or you could always try a rolling pin? I don't have one so I've never tried it that way either! Glad to hear everyone is coming along. Dorian still isn't squaking? Have you started to mush?
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Post by dearambellina on Jan 30, 2009 22:28:08 GMT -5
I'm going to start mushing tonight... I was going to last night but I came home and someone used my laptop and there was a trojan on it. So I just added more water to Dorian's food and have been fighting with the trojan. I ended up having to do a system restore. Smokey shocked me by eating a big hunk of chicken from Frodo's plate, bone and all! I really didn't think his teeth/jaws were strong enough. I've been keeping my eye out for a mortar and pestle because I've actually seen them at Ross for pretty cheap. But for now I'll use the rolling pin.
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Post by spiritualtramp on Jan 31, 2009 8:52:39 GMT -5
Yeah sometimes you can see them at yard sales and the like, too. But they can get expensive at specialty cook stores so make due with what you can until you find a good deal. I'm sorry to hear about the Trojan, that actually happened to me about two months ago. I had to do a system restore, too. What a pain in the butt. Congrats to Smokey ! What a smart kitty! Let me know what Dorian thinks of mushy kibble.
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Post by dearambellina on Jan 31, 2009 20:11:16 GMT -5
So far so good on mushy kibble! I keep hoping that one day Dorian will give up and eat meat but that's just not happening! hahaha
In the morning, after I feed the cats, whatever chunks with bone arent eaten I give to the ferrets. Charlotte was crunching on bone this morning!
I bought beef and beef heart today to introduce to the cats and I'll test it with the ferrets.
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Post by spiritualtramp on Feb 2, 2009 12:22:17 GMT -5
Wow that's awesome news. Everyone is coming along! Little Charlotte deserve a big kiss! Beef was the hardest thing for my kids to get acquainted to, don't know why, they just never got a taste for it. They still eat it but are finicky about how and why. With the heart, I always have to make it into a puree, or they won't care about it. And as a forewarning, and I don't know why, but Ranger for some reason cannot have more than a tablespoon or so of heart before he gags. I think he must have a sensitivity to it, and I don't think it's common, but something to think about I suppose. Glad everything is going smoothly so far
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Post by dearambellina on Feb 2, 2009 23:06:30 GMT -5
Had to back up a step with the cats. I added organs yesterday and my oldest and one of the girls vomited everything up. So it's back to plain raw for now.
Janey is really getting the hang of gnawing on chunks. I threw in a huge chunk of chicken that was about to get bad and when I checked a little later there were gnaw marks all over it.
Other than that, things are going well!
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Post by spiritualtramp on Feb 3, 2009 19:40:57 GMT -5
Okay, just as I predicted I guess! I'm going to look up organs and vomiting to see how common it is, since my Ranger does it sometimes and your kitties are having the problem.
Did they eat the organs whole or did you puree it? Perhaps you could try feeding smaller portions of organ with something easier on the tummy, like chicken or soup. Maybe this will curb any vomiting.
Hope the back one step proved to be okay, and the one girl's tummy is feeling better.
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Post by dearambellina on Feb 3, 2009 23:18:55 GMT -5
I had pureed it and mixed it all in with the ground chicken I did... over 4 pounds of ground chicken, too! This morning I gave everyone a tiny dollop of the chicken with organs, and then gave chunks of wing to the youngest cats, and plain ground turkey to the oldest. My younger male vomited. But that was it. Tonight all was well, no vomiting at all.
Can mice be a staple meat choice in ferret diet? I bought a bag of pinkies at petco last week and got around to giving the pinkies to them today and Jane thinks they're the greatest thing ever. Charlotte was interested in them, but she was also more interested in playing at the time. If mice can be a staple, it'd be SO much easier to transition them to those and give mice to them.
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Post by spiritualtramp on Feb 4, 2009 9:26:44 GMT -5
Okay I talked to the others about the vomiting thing, and three major points of interest came up: portion size, like I thought with my Ranger, could be the issue. Perhaps your kitties are eating too much, too quickly, and by serving smaller portions they won't overindulge. You could split the organ servings so that everyone just gets a small dollop daily.
Also check to make sure the organs aren't spoiled, since multiple cats have reacted, not just one, so that could be the issue.
And lastly, Heather suggests using a probiotic supplement for those that are sensitive to the richness of organ meat - health food stores sell probiotics in the refrigerated section, or you could use plain yogurt or plain kefir (make sure it's not the dannon or yoplait crap - Stonyfield Farms makes a good plain yogurt.) I'm actually going to pick some up next time I'm out to try it with Ranger. The thought is that by sprinkling some probiotic on the organ before serving, it'll help start to digest the meat so that it isn't as rich for the bellies of sensitive critters. I'll let you know how it goes with Ranger when I try it.
Mice can be fed often enough but I wouldn't make it a single staple - especially just pinkies. Work them up to all sizes of mice and then perhaps reconsider making it a larger part of their diet - but like any diet, variety is key to filling any gaps in nutrition, and feeding one source of food consistently will surely lead to deficiencies nutritionally. By feeding all ages of mouse, and in conjunction with raw and other whole prey, you'll be covering all of your bases. But still - I wouldn't make it the main basis and bulk of their diet.
Hope today went a bit smoother, and with less vomiting!
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Post by dearambellina on Feb 4, 2009 9:57:16 GMT -5
I weighed the meat i was giving them today and I was, in fact, giving them way too much. I always give my oldest cat more food than is suggested because he has a huge appetite because of his hyperthyroidism. I will be sure to pick some probiotics up, I used them a few months ago when my oldest cat had diarrhea and my dog had diarrhea constantly before I switched to raw and they worked SO well. I was planning on working the ferrets up the mice-size chain. I just wanted to start with pinkies because they have no fur and look the most like the chicken they get. For a moment, Jane thought I was the coolest mom ever, haha. I have to find something to make a hidey place for Jane to take her food; she's my bashful eater. If they're on sale, I may pick up one of those giant igloo things. I wish Dorian like Ferretone because that's my Enticement of Choice with the girls. I offered them the pinkies yesterday, they sniffed but didn't care. So I added a drop of ferretone and "Oh! Food?!" Jane grabbed the pinkie and took off with it! No such luck with a trick like that for Dorian.
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Post by spiritualtramp on Feb 5, 2009 9:29:36 GMT -5
LOL I know it's tough to entice them when they aren't into things like 'tone. But he's doing great so far, albeit a bit slow. How is he taking the mushy kibble? You can try adding very small amounts of ground meat to the mushed kibble now if you want.
For feeding dens, I have a bunch of cardboard boxes (I work at a bank and do the supply orders, so I get access to lots of free boxes.) Then I just recycle them once they start to get a little cruddy. My kids also seem to like to take their yummies to the few cat cubes I have around the apartment, but I try not to encourage that because washing those is a pain!
How are the kitties and fuzzies today?
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Post by dearambellina on Feb 5, 2009 10:19:59 GMT -5
Had to take a few steps back with Dorian. My mom had been taking care of the ferrets because I had to work late nights (nighttime is when I replenish the kibble bowl and give new ground/meat/mice) and my mom mentioned to me that Dorian was "looking skinny again" (He had lost weight when we had to put his last cagemate to sleep.) So I checked and holy moly was he skinny! I gave him a bowl of kibble with 'tone and he chowed down like he hadn't eaten in days. I know he was eating SOMETHING, because he was still pooping. This one is proving to be stubborn. I think I may go buy some baby food to see if I can get him to eat things using that. Or I was thinking about crumbling the treats he loves so much over the raw. I introduced him to the fuzzy mouse yesterday (which was a huge hit with the girls) and he seemed interested, but again, didn't realize it was food, sniffed it, sneezed at it, and ran away. I don't know what to do with this little stubborn mule of a ferret. I'll try crushing the treats and sprinkling those on the raw. What a stubborn brat.
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Post by dearambellina on Feb 5, 2009 10:27:12 GMT -5
Adding: I tried the treat crubled on raw. Dorian started licking the treat up but as soon as his tongue touched the chicken he started shaking his head really hard (what he's always done, even when I put a tiny bite of chicken in his mouth a few weeks ago) and freaked out and ran from the plate and won't go near it.
I suppose I'll be picking up some baby food on my way home...
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