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Post by aikidokim2 on Feb 20, 2009 11:05:49 GMT -5
1. How many ferrets do you currently have? What are their names, ages, genders, and do they have any health problems (this is VERY important)? 3 total- "Star", "Eclipse" and "Donut" all females. Star and Eclipse I just got 2-8-09 from a pet store, they are young, but I didnt get any paperwork with them telling me how old, and Donut is very old! She was found in a parking lot and I was given her from a vet clinic and told she would only live a few months (hospice case), but I have had her for almost 2 yrs now!! Donut has tumors. I was basically asked just to take care of Donut for her last little bit of time left. She was estimated to be btwn 5-7 yrs old when found. 2. What are your ferrets currently eating? Include their main diet, plus any treats or supplements (such as duk soup).
Donut gets EVO dry kibble with Science Diet TD for treats. Star and Eclipse right now are on a mix of EVO, Marshalls ferret food and Orijen kibble and are also given some raw meats. Star and Eclipse also get Duk Soup mixed on/in food along with Ferrotone. Eclipse only eats the kibble at this time. All are given assorted Marshall's ferret treats and Star and Eclipse also eat Daily Dream Treats and Stella and Chewy's carnivore crunch treats. Star and Eclipse also occassionally get a ferret chewy treat of some sort. 3. What kind of diet do you want to switch to?Pref raw, whole (frozen-thawed) prey type diet(s) with minimual, if any, kibble 4. Why do you want to switch to this more natural diet? Believe it would be much healthier as long as it was properly balanced 5. Where/what/who got you interested in natural diets?I have been interested in it with my dogs, just never switched them, and then began talking to someone I met that has ferrets who told me to try raw with them. 6. Please list the current weight for your ferret(s). Do they appear overweight? Underweight? How is there muscle tone? Star is much heavier, not fat, more muscle, bigger frame. Eclipse is smaller frame, good weight, more slender build. Donut is probably a bit underwt, but she is starting to not eat as much. 7. What is the condition of your ferret's teeth/gums? (can you get a picture?) Star/Eclipse-Good, Donut-a little tartar/plaque 8. Describe the texture/color of your ferrets coat. Star/Eclipse-soft,shiny (dark brown, sables) Donut- (dk bro- sable) very coarse 9. How often does your ferret go to the bathroom?Star/Eclipse-Seems like all the time!! LOL Donut- Not as much as she used to, since she not eating much anymore. (I believe she is coming to her time to leave here and go to the other side ( ) 10. Does your ferret's feces and/or urine smell?Star/Eclipse- no, only when they eat the EVO dry (for some reason), when EVO is moistened they don't smell. Donut- very stinky!!
11. Smell your ferret. How strong is their odor? Star/Eclipse- not strong at all. Donut-can smell her without getting near her! 12. On a scale of 1-10, 1 being completely lethargic and 10 being "through the roof!" what is your ferret's energy level? Star-about 7-8, Eclipse- about 5-6 and Donut- about 1-2 13. How excited is your ferret about meal time (when fed kibble)? Star acts excited til she realizes its kibble, she goes CRAZY for raw chick thigh meat, Eclipse only eats kibble at this time, but doesn't go "crazy" like Star. 14. Have you attempted to switch from kibble to a natural diet in the past? If so, what methods have you tried. Be specific.Not in the past, just what I have been trying with Star/Eclipse now. Have offered them a "soupie" of raw meat, duk soup, whole egg, baby food blended, both will eat that, depending on the meat and baby food. Donut wouldn't touch it! Star will eat almost any kind of meat if mixed with chick thigh meat. Have also offered other raw muscle meats (Star eats it) Started offering chick wingettes, Star will eat some of it. 15. What other information about your ferret(s) would you like to share? Nothing 16. If you can, please post a clear photograph of EACH of your ferrets directly below:
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Post by sherrylynne on Feb 20, 2009 23:37:41 GMT -5
Hello again . You will probably have a few of us popping in here with ideas about switching your ferrets. There are many ways to do this. You mentioned Star is already eating some raw. What kind of raw? Ground, chunks, bone in? If we have an idea, then everyone will know where you need to progress from. Mine started with raw puree mixed with duck soup, others start at ground, and some leap right into chunks and bone in . Has either Donut or Eclipse shown any interest in raw at all? Even just licking at it?
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Post by aikidokim2 on Feb 22, 2009 0:04:09 GMT -5
Star has so far eaten chicken thigh meat chunks, some Natures Variety ground, I even recently gave her a chicken wingette, which she also ate! It seems she will try just about anything I give her. I also gave them some "soup" with cut up meat, duk soup, whole egg and baby food. I also tried chicken organs, but that didn't seem to go over too well. I also tried the organs in the "soup", which was eventually eaten. Any new meats I give though, seems to go over better if I mix it with the chunks of chicken thigh meat. I have tried ground wild turkey, ground venison, NV rabbit, & ground beef. Donut shows absolutely no interest in raw, she will actually push it out of her cage!!! ) Eclipse initially would only smell the raw and then go eat kibble, but the past couple days I have "caught" Eclipse trying the chicken thigh chunks and wingette! I did start coating the chicken chunks with Ferretone and Duk Soup in an attempt to entice Eclipse, seems to be helping! However, I have noticed Star seems to be a bit protective of the raw food!
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Post by sherrylynne on Feb 22, 2009 11:39:18 GMT -5
Mine *fight* over their meat all the time ! Not unusual to see two ferrets on either end of a chunk playing tug and hissing all the while, so I wouldn't worry about Star's protectiveness. It's really great that you are offering all this variety for them. Means they won't imprint on one kind of meat! Does Donut like soupies? If she does, you could try mixing in about a tsp of pureed raw with it, see how she does. With the others, when you say Star ate the drumette, did she eat the bone as well? And with Eclipse, if she will eat the thigh chunks, keep giving them! That's wonderful . Maybe try mixing in a couple pieces of other meat with the chicken, see if she eats it.
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Post by aikidokim2 on Feb 23, 2009 1:03:59 GMT -5
Donut won't touch the soupies either, I had it on a very shallow dish and she somehow pushed the dish, soupie and all, out of her cage!!! ) At first, I thought the bones and all were eaten from the wingette, but then I found the 2 bones under some of the litter! (They "hide" the meat/food in the litter!!) I was a little disappointed at first, but then I figured this is all new to me and them and the bones were TOTALLY clean, so I can't expect them to do everything immediately! They may have eaten some of the ends of the bones though, they looked a bit jagged and I thought they should've been a little longer than what they were! I do have a sampling of whole-frozen prey that was given to me to try with them, but I wasn't sure when they would be "ready" to try eating whole prey. (I have a few different sized mice, chicks and I believe quail chicks.)
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Post by aikidokim2 on Feb 24, 2009 13:47:02 GMT -5
Is the Nature's Variety ground raw food ok to feed to them regularly? I wasn't sure since it contains fruits/vegs and numerous diff types of eggs. I was told not to feed them fruits/vegs and to limit their egg consumption to a treat only about once a wk or so. Bad news! Donut passed on last night!! (
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Post by sherrylynne on Feb 28, 2009 15:51:14 GMT -5
I am so sorry to hear about Donut! Poor baby. And I apologize for not checking your thread earlier. I simply assumed you'd been assigned a mentor! For the whole prey, you can try them at any point with it. I started with pinkies chopped up in their soupies, but then, mine are stubborn. If you give it, you may have to cut it open so they know there is food inside all that fur, with the older prey. And NV raw is fine, but if they eat that exclusively, they won't get the stronger jaws and tooth flossing effect of raw/whole prey! It's not too surprising they didn't eat all the bone. They have to build up their jaw strength for that! But it really sounds like they're on their way! You're doing a great job with them . Just keep giving meat chunks, and if they will take larger ones, great! If not- you can build up to it. Also, keep on trying them with the bone. Wing tips are a great starter bone, as well as the middle section of the wing. Just separate the two bones in there for them right now. Let us know how it goes!
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Post by aikidokim2 on Mar 4, 2009 16:12:21 GMT -5
Thanks for the help. No, I haven't been assigned a mentor. But then again, I may not have done something correctly when I joined!! LOL ) (I will admit, I was getting a little discouraged) Do they normally take to the muscle meats better than the organs, or is that also depend on the individual? Mine will eat the muscle, but don't seem to keen on the organs. (I tried the chicken hearts, livers and gizzards. I tried chicken since they seem to prefer chicken muscle meat)
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Post by sherrylynne on Mar 5, 2009 10:33:49 GMT -5
Hi, there again! So glad to see you back . Well, it looks like I'm going to be your mentor . Let me tell you a little about myself, then we'll get to dealing with the "dreaded" organ meats As you've noticed, my name is Sherry, and I live in Calgary, Alberta, Canada. I'm 50, got my own business cleaning. Enough about me- now to the important things- fuzzies! I presently have 4 of my own, and 2 foster ferrets. Mine are Boris(sable) and Vincent(albino), two 1 1/2yr. old brothers(littermates), Sinnead(3yr. old sable female), and Lucrezia, a 10m. old marked DEW who's also deaf. They are all brats! The switch for my guys was-interesting! Lucrezia was an easy switch, because she was only 12 weeks when she went raw. Sinnead wasn't too far behind. Vincent had a setback when he choked on a piece too big for him to swallow, the piggy. He was fine, but scared off raw for about a week. Boris? Well, to this day, every time I try something new with Boris, he's convinced I'm poisoning him . Even with his organ soupies, since it's weekly, it's always new to him. I have to scruff, put some on his nose as he's twisting to get away, THEN he realizes, "Hey- I've had this before, and I like it!". But he still has to be fed on my lap from a spoon, or he wn't eat it As for my fosters- there is Zeus, who I'm convinced is going to be as difficult a switch as Boris was . He's a 2yr. old happy-go-lucky cuddly boy, silver in colour, and his bonded cagemate, Athena. She's a light sable, who has decided she far prefers real food to that awful kibbles. She's been an easy switch so far. Still have to see how she does with organ meats The advantages of a raw diet are amazing! They have so much energy, they run rings around my fosters, who are just starting their switch. Their fur is so soft, their teeth are gleaming white(which means no dental costs- yippee!), and, as I found out recently, their healing capacity is dramatically improved! Sinnead sliced her tongue open quite badly. It was cut 1/3 of the way across, right through, top to bottom. In a week, she was pronounced over 95% healed, and was back to her regular diet, bone and all, within 2 weeks from the date of the injury! Don't worry so much about the bone and organ just yet, we'll get them there ! Most ferrets(not all) seem to prefer muscle meats to organ and bone. It tastes better than organ, and is easier to eat than bone. If they'll eat it, great, if not, we'll work on it. So, just to give me an idea, what kind of meats are they eating now?And what sizes are the chunks? And do try to post in every couple of days, so we can stay on top of the transition, ok?
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Post by aikidokim2 on Mar 12, 2009 12:46:00 GMT -5
Hi Sherry, Sorry its been a little bit since I was on, I was very busy and then had to get a new computer and get it up and running and all!! Any ways, I have been mainly feeding them chicken thighs, either boneless/skinless, cut up into 1/4-1/2 inch chunks, or I have also been trying the chicken thighs w/skin and bone. I also will give them chicken "wingettes". The meats with the bones, I put in as is and let them work at getting the meat off. I also recently did have some extra organ soupie frozen, so I thawed it out and added a little extra warm water mixed in and they did eat it with it watered down. Star seems to be the one that prefers the raw over the kibble, whereas Eclipse will eat a little of the raw, but seems to prefer the kibble. It's hard sometimes to know exactly who is eating what since I put their dish in the cage and check back later and see it gone. The only reason I have been sticking with the chicken is bc that seems to be what they prefer and I am still trying to get Eclipse eating it more consistently. I have tried other types of meat, but it was ground and they didn't seem to care to much for it, not sure if it was the meat or bc it was ground!!
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Post by sherrylynne on Mar 12, 2009 22:43:59 GMT -5
Hi, nice to see you back ! Good job with the chicken cubes, by the way. I found that once mine started eating cubes, forget the ground, no interest whatsoever . Try slipping in a smaller cube of a different meat with the chicken cubes as well. Ferrets are basically lazy by nature, and I've found that if there is a smaller cube of something, they all try to go for that one. Less work for them, you know I also found if I left free access to the kibble, a couple of them would eat it by preference, so I took it out entirely. It means you have to keep an eye on who's eating what, though. What helped me was to take the kibble out at night, and then in the morning, I'd make sure the meat was at least at room temperature, and either take the fuzzes into the kitchen, or the bathroom, and feed them a piece at a time, and watch them eat. Usually they'd eat a couple or three of 1/2 inch cubes each, then start to stash. That's when we'd quit with the hand feeding, and put the rest up to put in the cage later. With Eclipse, since she will eat the raw if she's hungry(even if she prefers kibble), she'll probably eat the meat when it's offered. If she doesn't eat enough of the raw(should be about 1 1/2- 2 ounces per meal), then offer the kibble once they are back in the cage. I actually found a cheap kitchen scale was my best friend , because it turned out I was giving far more than they could eat! Anyway, try that, see how it goes, and let me know.
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Post by aikidokim2 on Mar 16, 2009 12:34:33 GMT -5
Thanks for the info on the amount of raw they should be getting, I wasn't sure how much they should actually get, that's why I would make sure they had free choice of kibble if I wasn't going to be home for a while. (I wanted to make sure they always had something to eat if they did get hungry!!) Do you give them numerous small meals of raw throughout the day, or do you give them enough to last through a portion of the day? I wasn't sure how long the raw should/could be sitting out and still be o.k. for them to eat with no adverse effects. Eclipse will eat the dried meat treats (such as Carnivore Crunch-Duck from Stella/Chewy's and the Daily Dream Treats-Chicken from Wysong), should I try putting more of those types of foods in the food dish instead of the kibble for when I won't be home for a while? I assume they would be better for them vs the kibble and I didn't know if it would help Eclipse with the transition to raw. I did give them NV raw (rabbit) the other day, and it took them a bit, but it was completely eaten!
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Post by sherrylynne on Mar 16, 2009 18:18:51 GMT -5
They sound like they are doing well! It's nice to hear. I feed mine(for 4 of them) approx. 7-8 ounces per meal. I feed twice a day. Whatever they don't eat immediately gets put in the cage until the next feeding, when I take it out, and put in fresh. Don't forget- ferrets aren't susceptible to things like salmonella from fresh meats. By fresh, I mean something that's no more than, say, a week or two old . Mine love their own version of homemade jerky if they can get away with some to stash, and I don't find it! When I give freeze dried is if they have finished everything for their meal, just to nibble on until the next one, or if they have to spend the day at the vet's. I also use it as treats, along with jerkies, dehydrated liver treats, etc. I just checked my bag of Stella and Chewy's, and it's a complete meat, so yes, if they'll take that instead of kibble, great!! How are they doing with introducing new meats, by the way? Any takers yet? If they absolutely refuse to touch new meats, you may have to introduce them with their soupies. I still have to do that with Boris. He's such a spoiled brat!
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Post by aikidokim2 on Mar 16, 2009 18:52:58 GMT -5
I haven't tried anything "new" yet. I have tried other meats (ground) in the past, which they ate but weren't as excited about it like they (Star especially) are about the chicken. I was going to try some venison that was cut into chunks and see if they just prefer the chunks over ground, but the meat that we had thawed out, I was afraid to use it, I wasn't sure if it was still any good or not. (My boyfriend had taken it out to eat himself, so I didn't take any of it bc I thought he was going to eat it, but then he never cooked it!!) I didn't realize that they could "safely" eat meat that was that "old" (a week or two!!) Good to know though ) The dehydrated liver treats you use, are they the same ones that are sold for dogs? I saw them and was wondering if they would be ok to give to the ferrets. I still have a "sampling" of whole prey that someone gave me to try, which I obviously haven't yet! I was going to try it, but then I started to see postings from others that they don't eat the guts! I think Star would at least be the most interested in it, not sure if she would know it was actually food or not! ) Then I saw postings that said to cut open the whole prey to let them know it was food, but I don't think I could do that!! LOL
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Post by sherrylynne on Mar 16, 2009 22:50:20 GMT -5
First of all, by "old", I mean something they've stashed themselves, and I haven't found . It dries out, instead of rotting when it's been exposed to air for a while. If it's been in the fridge in a package for a week, odds are they won't touch it. I made the mistake of giving mine some duck I thought was still good, and they refused to eat it. I found out a few hours later when I went by the cage and caught a whiff of rotting meat. EEEEWWWWW! Fuzzes are smart that way(and many other ways!). If they've eaten an old stashed meat, you can usually tell by the funky poos. The liver treats I use are made by my friend, but any treats that are pure meat, with no grain, veg, or fruit would be great. And no, with whole prey, I usually find the guts left behind in the cage, if the mouse was large enough. With the smaller ones, they usually eat everything. Unless your Sinnead(my 3yr old). She just eats the head, legs, and tail. Doesn't matter the size(unless they get pinkies). She leaves the rest for the others to finish. Which they do Like I was mentioning though, try a few smaller cubes of, say, beef or pork mixed in with the chicken. Or venison if you like. Just decrease the chicken by that amount. To make sure they are hungry enough to eat the new meat, just offer a total of two ounces for the both of them, including the new meat. They may not take it right away, but give them 30 minutes or so to eat. Once they finish that, if they do, then give them however much the difference is for a normal meal. At the very least, they'll start to get used to the smell of something new, and will accept it sooner or later. I think if you do this a few times, hunger will start to add spice to the new meat!
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