Ernie, Didjeridu and Ramona start the switch!

[animalsgetrevenge]

Today is our starting day. I let the kids eat their kibble until 2pm, then took it away. At five I mashed up some kibble and hot water until it was the consistency of canned cat food and let it cool off a bit. Everyone was asleep so I placed them back into the cage with the new food in the middle so they could gather around. Didjeridu and Ernie, my boys, went straight for it and pigged out. Ramona (our little girl, it took a month to find her the right name) licked the EDGE of the bowl and was pleased but wouldn’t lick the food! I took away the bowl and put the mix into a shallow dish. When I came back the boys looked confused, “What are you doing you crazy human? We were EATING that!”. I gave it back and everyone went at it again, this time Ramona licked the food but she wasn’t eating it. The boys made their own little dents in the bowl and went in the bottom half of the FN to chill out. Ramona finally started eating little chunks from the bowl! Then the boys both came up for more. They really didn’t eat that much but they all tried it AND enjoyed it! That is a great start. I loved watching them eat with their faces all scrunched up and their eyes nearly closed. It looked like they wanted to eat it but didn’t like the smell! Haha, do any of you have ferrets that make funny eating faces?

My plan for the rest of the day: Leave the wet food out for 4 hours, then dump the remains. I’m going to try to get to the store to buy the ground raw chicken “pet food” to add a tiny bit to their evening meal! If not I will feed this again.

My original plan was to feed 50/50 raw and kibble until I feel comfortable handing and feeding meat, but I really want to do the best for my beasts so I’m going to try for 100% raw after the switch. I unfortunately bought a 40lb bag of Natural Gold and opened it less than two weeks ago! I already seal-a-mealed it into packages and stuck them in my fridge. I am going to try to sell them on Craigslist.com and try to get PART of my $60.00 back (I hate to waste money! Gah!). I am also going to look into buying a second hand mini fridge/freezer to keep the pet food in so my man and I don’t have to think about the meat even being near our food… also a cutting board, knives and such. I’m sure that sounds really weird and obsessive but this is truly a huge leap for me in a direction I am pretty uncomfortable with! I will have to take it a day at a time and with a sense of humor!

Any comments or suggestions for the newbie?
Wish me luck guys!

[Forum Administrator]

Well first of all I really want to commend you for doing what is best for your ferrets, even if it conflicts with your own personal eating beliefs (being vegan---for the others that do not know ) The fact that you've decided to go 100% raw all by yourself is not uncommon, and its also why I dont push people into going 100% raw. Oftentimes people find that if they just get started on it, they make the choice themselves, which is certainly nice lol

It sounds like you're off to a great start! Im glad they are eating the moist kibble. Be prepared for loose and/or stinky poopies. Again, you can offer unflavored pedialyte if "the runs" persist. This will keep them hydrated.

Dont get discouraged if you add the petfood and they look at you like "huh? Im not eating THAT!" Just be patient and calm and if you hit a snag or a road bump, just post here and we can assist you right over that hurdle.

As for having a seperate fridge/freezer and cutting board and what not. That is normal too. Some people dont want frozen mice and meat in with their foods, or maybe there isnt a enough space for it all lol. Mini fridge/freezers usually arent that big. A better investment IMO would be a chest freezer because that will allow you to store more food. Buying in bulk can save you a fad wad of cash

As for the Natural Gold, people might be hesitant to buy it off cragislist, BUT another honorable way to get rid of it, is to find a local ferret shelter, explain why you no longer need the food, and ask if they would like it. DO mention its been opened and "seal-a-mealed".

It might be smart to save a small bag or two, though. (in case you hit a snag in the switch and you need to use some crushed kibble to introduce some familiarity and coax them to try a new food )

I can't wait to see how your babies do with the switch! The difference in a natural fed ferret is astounding. You can hear people talk about it all day long, but until you EXPERIENCE it yourself, you cant really grasp what we mean.



and as always, we are here to assist We strive to get questions answered in 12 hours or less, so we are always at the ready to answer what ya need.

[animalsgetrevenge]

Thanks Giuli, I'll update later tonight about how things go! As always, I REALLY appreciate the help and support

[Forum Administrator]

Thank and hey, its no problem. I really feel natural nutrition for pets is vitial and I'll do whatever it takes to make that happen I dont mind one bit because I truely feel that this is what I was "born to do" and ya know what? I love every minute of it.

[animalsgetrevenge]

So tonight I went to New Seasons (a local Whole Food like store) and bought 2lbs of raw frozen ground chicken meat and organs for $2.99 a pound. I also bought 3 chicken wings and 3 drumsticks for less that 3 dollars total... which seems really reasonable. I am worried about costs because I'm a student on a budget but it was less that I thought for antibiotic free, veggie fed chicken.

I was all excited and prepared their meal when I got home. I used about half wet kibble and half of the chicken mix at room temperature. They were all interested but no one really ate any... I will try again tomorrow, maybe they will eat if once they realize that is their only option! If not I will add less meat next time.

But, I have good news, too. First, I held up a drumstick for the ferrets to sniff and Digj was VERY interested. He licked it a lot but didn't know what to do with it. The others were interested but not that excited about it.

ALSO good news: I gave my doggygirl, Ajax, a drumstick and she LOVED it. I made her stand in the bathtub (she is a small, 18lb boston mix) but she ripped off its skin and really shredded the meat right off the bone. She cracked the bone open and ate most of it until I took it away. She was in doggy heaven. She had already ate her kibble dinner but she made room for this special treat. I would like to get Ajax and by man's chihuahua, Vita, into raw too, which shouldn't be hard at all Except that they spend many days a week at my parents house with their dog eating kibble. Right now she is asleep, stomach up on my legs... my boyfriend is passed out on the carpet next to us. I wish my camera was closer, I want a picture of this!

[Forum Administrator]

I can assist you in putting your puppers onto raw None of your dogs "gulp" their food, do they? With "gulpers" you have to be careful because they could choke. Doesnt sound that this is the case with your guys though. For small dogs you will feed foods that are about the same size as your ferret's food: chicken wings and thighs and legs, turkey necks, stuff like that. With dogs its best to transition them cold turkey (most arent picky) you just take away their kibble and start them on raw. Some funky poops (and even barfing 1-2 time is normal, as their body "sorts out" how to digest this new food). You really want to be sure and sepearte kibble meals and raw meals (for ferts its okay during the transition but you still want to minimize the amount of raw/kibble you feed together. Here is why (cross post from ferret.com):

Why feed raw and kibble apart?

Because they digest at different rates. Allow me to explain this better, salmonella bacteria requries a certain amount of time to bloom and multiply in the gut (thus causing salmonosis and making a person/pet sick) now ferrets have a rapid GI tract that is highly acidic, so the bacteria really doesnt have time to multiply to appreciable levels and make the ferret sick. Now. Enter kibble. Kibble takes ALOT longer then raw to digest (if you can even call it digest lol, there are so many indigestible parts in kibble ) if you mix raw and kibble you slow down the process of the meat going through the ferret's GI tract. This could POSSIBLY allow for the meat to transmit salmonosis to your ferret. That being said, I've read a study that was based out of the UK that showed that less then 2-3% of all grocery store meat (in the UK) was infected with salmonella (and other food bourne bacteria). So the true risk of coming into contact WITH salmonella infected chicken (again not ALL chicken contains it is fairly low, but its better to be "safe then sorry".

During the transitional phase to a raw diet some people will blend raw and kibble in an attempt to get their ferret to eat. The BEST way to do this is to only sprinkle a bit of ground kibble on top of some meat (as opposed to mixing raw chicken chunks and kibble pieces). Another method involves slowly moistening the kibble with water, then gradually mixing in ground meat with the kibble and replacing the kibble. Your best bet is to minimize the time you feed kibble and raw together. Again, the true odds of your ferret becoming ill arent too terribly high, but it could still happen, so just play it safe. Minimize the amount of kibble that is mixed with raw.


So for your puppers if you decide NOT to go cold turkey (pun intended ) then feed kibble early in the moning and then raw later at night (when there is no kibble in the tummy)

If your ferts continue to turn their nose up at the meat, go a bit slower and introduce it sloooowwwwllllyyy.

[animalsgetrevenge]

I haven't posted because my internet has been out and I've been insanely busy. Luckily I haven't had trouble with the transition and no questions!

All three have been eating what I've been making them! YAY!

I've been feeding about 50/50 kibble and ground chicken/chicken organs with water. Yesterday I added in some cut up chicken wing and they LOVED it. Now they are eating about 75% raw and 25% kibble with warm water. Each meal I add a little less kibble and a little less water and it going great! My goal is to have the kibble completely out of the mix by Friday night, wish me luck! Then from there the meat chunks will get larger, I'm so excited to see this working!

We have a quick visit to the vet on Friday to get their vaccines updated. Should I mention anything about their new diet to the vet? Its a small/exotic animal vet that MOSTLY sees ferrets... isn't that awesome?

This might sound weird but you are all ferret people so you will understand: Last night Ernie took the most beautiful poo ever. It was so nice and solid, much less goopy that with his kibble I know, I'm crazy.

[Forum Administrator]

Good to hear all is well! No, you arent weird for oohhing and ahhing at poop

You can mention the diet switch to your vet, but be forewarned that your vet might tell you:

a.) You'll kill your ferret
b.) Your ferret will get a calcium deficiency
c.) Your ferret will get salmonella, e.coli (insert food bourne bacteria here) and die
d.) YOU will get salmoneall, e.coli (insert food bourne bacteria here)
e.) You cant feed a balanced natural diet and you should be feeding (insert kibble here)
f.) Your ferret will choke on chicken bones
g.) Your ferret will become more agressive if you feed meat
h.) Your ferret's teeth wont get clean unless they eat kibble

ALL total BS, BUT be prepared because you might have to deal with it. Vets just arent properly educated in nutrition Im afraid (but what can you expect when the majority of their nutritional training comes from KIBBLE COMPANIES!) I lucked out and found a vet that knows I know what I am doing and that NO im not going to kill my pet. Others arent so lucky. You can bring it up and see how your vet reacts, or you can wait to bring it up until you are a bit more experienced with a natural diet and you can counter their critiques like 1-2-3. Its up to you.

Either way

[animalsgetrevenge]

Thanks! Also, I am trying to get them onto a feeding schedule that so that they can expect meals at the same time each day... or at least close!

Would it be okay to...
Feed them three times a day, leaving them locked in their cage with food for one hour, then take away whatever hasn't been eaten? Would it be better to let them have the option of food for longer than one hour? Shorter? Feed more or less than three times a day?


I'm usually up at 7am, gone from 11-4 or 5 and asleep by 11pm.
SO... I can start feeding as early as 7am and finish feeding as late as 11pm.

I was thinking I'd feed:
From 10am-11am, then
From 5-6pm, then
From 9-10pm

Or:
From 7-8am, then
From 10-11am, then
From 6pm-7pm


Does that makes sense? Whats your take on that? How long is it okay to NOT have food available? I want them to be comfortable, of course, that why I am asking!

Also, I got home this afternoon and fed them ground raw chicken/chicken organs with a small squirt of ferretvite and ferretone (just for flavor and because they are used to it) WITH NO KIBBLE! My boys bother went for it and Ramona didn't want to try. I'll give her some time

[Forum Administrator]

With the whole schedule thing either way sounds fine . My guys get food 2x per day. I put food in their cage and it sits out till its eaten. On days where its a bit warmer, I do what you are suggesting. I offer them food for like 1 hour and then take it away (and put it in the fridge) then I offer it again later. Ferrets can go 24 hours without food, so as long as you offer food several times a day, you are fine . When you get to the point where you are feeding raw meaty bones (chicken wings, legs, etc) you want to be sure that they have enough time to eat the meat AND the bone

Also, I got home this afternoon and fed them ground raw chicken/chicken organs with a small squirt of ferretvite and ferretone (just for flavor and because they are used to it) WITH NO KIBBLE! My boys bother went for it and Ramona didn't want to try. I'll give her some time

Hooray! Progress, its excellent, isnt it? Dont worry about Ramona. Every ferret is different and some take longer to switch (that's totally normal). Keep working with her at her own pace. You'll get there!

[animalsgetrevenge]

My kids have now been about 36 hours without kibble!

They are doing really well, too. Last night I fed them ground chicken/organs with a tiny bit of water and they chowwed down :) No kibble, no ferretone, no ferretvite and they gobbled it up anyway!

Today I'm going to thaw out a chicken wing and try putting little chunks of it in with their ground meal. I'm also going to New Seasons later for human food so I will pick something up for them because their food is in the fridge is getting low.

I'm thinking I will pick up organs (they carry beef and chicken) and maybe a cornish game hen if they have any in stock. I want them to start getting variety into their diet and hopefully start eating bones ASAP.

Questions:

If I decide to supplement my ferrets with human grade bone meal (since they aren't eating bones yet), how much should I mix in with their food?

Now they they are getting used to the ground chicken/organs, will I have trouble getting them to try other meats/parts?

I'm confused about what IS considered an organ and what ISN'T, it seems like everone has their own opinion. Liver? Heart? Kidney? What can I feed as organ?

A question about questions(haha): Should I be asking them here or in the newbie question section?

[animalsgetrevenge]

Oh gosh, the cutest thing just happened...

I went in to the ferret room to grab their food dish so I could make their breakfast. The cage door was open, Ernie and Ramona were asleep somewhere and Didj was on the bottom level of the cage.

When I came back, Didjer and Ramona were both on the top half of the cage, where I have been feeding them, looking out at me with begging eyes! I swear they both knew I was coming back with food and wanted to be the first to eat! Hahaha. They are so adorable! Maybe I'm just crazy but I think they like their chicken meals!

[Forum Administrator]

Questions:

If I decide to supplement my ferrets with human grade bone meal (since they aren't eating bones yet), how much should I mix in with their food?

Honestly I wouldnt use bonemeal. Its cooked and you have to be SO careful when picking out bonemeal (sometimes it can contain lead!) use ground eggshell. 1 tsp per 1 cup of meat ;)

Now they they are getting used to the ground chicken/organs, will I have trouble getting them to try other meats/parts?

I have found that the leap from kibble to raw is more difficult then the leap from one raw food to another. It might take a little bit of work, but it shouldnt be as difficult as getting them onto raw in the first place. Eating bones takes practice, but they'll get the hang of it.

I'm confused about what IS considered an organ and what ISN'T, it seems like everone has their own opinion. Liver? Heart? Kidney? What can I feed as organ?

"If it doesnt secrete, feed it as meat."

Organs: Kidneys, liver, lung, pancreas
Muscles: gizzards and heart

I feed things that are inside the animal (whether they are technically organs or not) 1 day per week. I feed a meal of heart, liver, gizzards, and kidney.

A question about questions(haha): Should I be asking them here or in the newbie question section?

Either place is fine ;)

[Forum Administrator]

Maybe I'm just crazy but I think they like their chicken meals

It wouldnt suprise me Imagine if all you ate was cereal and one day someone offered you a nice, fresh meal of unproccessed food. You'd think you were in heaven!

[animalsgetrevenge]

This afternoon Tony and I went to New Seasons. I bought one "whole chicken leg" and one pound of chicken livers. We brought the kids to the vet to get their rabies and distemper updated and everything went well there. While we were waiting in the front room we met three other ferrets, a rat and a bearded dragon, which is one thing I love about our vet. They see mostly ferrets so each time I am there I get to meet new fuzzies

When we got home I offered the ferrets small bone chunks from the ends of the chicken leg and some mushed up liver, just so they could try both. They all licked at the liver but weren't really interested. Didger was very curious about the bone. He licked at it, picked it up, and carried it to the corner of the cage to investigate it. I tied a piece of hemp string to it and bounced it around in the air to get his attention. He and Ramona grabbed at it and pulled at it. Ramona is a little beast! Neither of them knew what to do with it besided chew off tiny bits of meat and then they lost interest and passed out. I took away their bowl and mixed the liver with their normal chicken/organ mix. I woke them up and they all tried it and went back to bed. Oh well, they will learn to like it... hopefully. If not I will keep trying

I'm feeling determined!