xeopse
Cageless and Roamin' Free
Raw Feeder
Posts: 235
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Post by xeopse on Oct 28, 2010 21:32:08 GMT -5
Lulabelle is constipated I believe =( Her belly is firm, not hard or distended, but it is firmer than usual. Her appetite is normal, eating like a horse, but her poop is sad to see =( It is this tiny little glob when she goes, but she is peeing normally. I'm assuming it's constipation since her little bum puckers up when I pick her up up as if she wants to go but she can't, but when I press on her abd/pelvis she does not have any negative response as to being uncomfortable or in pain. I ordered powdered eggshell online from a raw vet supply place and it should be here in a couple days I hope. In the mean time, what do I do? I tried searching the forum for constipation but found nothing... is there something I can giver her to help move things along - it's been two days so far. She is acting like normal weirdo Lulabelle so I'm not terribly worried but I imagine this could get worse, especially if it's not constipation.
I tried giving them whole chicken quarters tonight inside the bathroom to see what they did. Lulabelle for whatever reason is the ONLY ferret that has that ferret-like obsession with dragging things, none of the other ferrets do this ever for any reason. Lulabelle drags toys, food, towels to a certain extent. She tried to drag the WHOLE chicken quarter which much weigh twice as much as she does across the bathroom floor TWICE. So she can't feel too bad with a sore belly if she's dragging that much meat around the whole bathroom. It's pretty gross having them drag raw chicken around the floor but I don't really care - I figure it's strengthening muscles they really don't have and need to work on.
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Post by sherrylynne on Oct 29, 2010 17:40:48 GMT -5
Start giving her some pumpkin. She's not eating bone, so there's nothing to firm up the stool, which means the muscles in the bowel really have nothing to push against. Try her with 1/2 tsp twice a day right now.
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xeopse
Cageless and Roamin' Free
Raw Feeder
Posts: 235
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Post by xeopse on Oct 29, 2010 17:53:25 GMT -5
WOO! The powdered eggshell came in today! I sprinkled a teaspoon into their food as soon as it came in the mail around lunch time. How long do you think until she can have a better stool? I am so used to dogs and cats whose digestive systems are so much longer... I am always amazed by how much poop they can produce in just a few hours! I imagine it would go through quicker than a dog, who I normally don't see poop issues resolved if Leia eats something bad (she ate a whole loaf of 12-grain bread when she's severely allergic to grain... ) until the next day. As gross as it is, I can't see just Lulabelle's (or anyone else's) stool unless I keep her in the bathroom for a little while after she wakes up. With 5 ferrets it's tough to tell whose poops is whose in the cage or free roaming around the house. So I just let her poop wherever in the bathroom to inspect. When people ask me how hard it is to have 5 ferrets, I tend to forget how gross it is and I always respond with how awesome having a few is... then I remember later the fine details of owning five
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xeopse
Cageless and Roamin' Free
Raw Feeder
Posts: 235
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Post by xeopse on Oct 29, 2010 21:04:42 GMT -5
Oh wow, that was quick. I just watched her go to the bathroom and her stool is already far better. It's almost solid even, better than what it looked like on kibble definitely. She is pooping quite a bit though, I imagine she was pretty impacted because she is actually sleeping next to the litter box which she never does... must have figured she'd save herself a few trips.
The powdered eggshell btw is from homevet.com and actually came to me in a container from a vets office - Dr. Jeff Feinman. A lot of the website seems to be pretty dedicated to supplements for rawfeeding which is always nice. You need a minimum order of $25 though which kind of sucked, but I ordered some freeze dried tripe for Leia too to make the ordering minimum. She loves it but it smells terrible lol
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Post by sherrylynne on Oct 30, 2010 10:34:24 GMT -5
I'm glad the eggshell is helping her! Not so sure she was constipated, though. More likely not enough bulk to push through the stool that was in the bowel. Which the eggshell replaces. And I've had fresh tripe in the house before, so yeah- I'm familiar with that...distinctive...smell From the time it goes into their mouths, til it comes out the other end is on average 3-4 hours. So their systems process/digest the food really fast. Her stools should consistently improve as she starts eating bone.
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xeopse
Cageless and Roamin' Free
Raw Feeder
Posts: 235
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Post by xeopse on Oct 31, 2010 22:56:29 GMT -5
Everyone's stool went from a very dark, loose stool that was various shades of dark brown and green, almost black and now since within a few hours of giving the eggshell everyone's stools are light yellow. Am I giving too much? I only gave a teaspoon between all 5 of them mixed into to their food. They eat two bowls of food during 24 hours or so before I pick it up, sometimes I have to give more but usually it's about enough. I don't have a kitchen scale so I haven't weighed it. I'm not used to have to measuring foods... I just eyeball it for Leia and see how her poop does - if its white/chalky then she gets less bone next meal, if it's too soft then she gets more bone. What is a NORMAL poop supposed ot look like? While I was cleaning out the box tonight I noticed someone had very, very dry stool but everything else was on par. I am so used to dog/cat/rabbit/monkey/rodent poops that are small and compact - a "normal" ferret stool on kibble is what I would consider as soft, so now I have no idea what to look for in a soupie ferret. Will salmon oil turn their stool yellow maybe? I give them 3 capsules in their meal once a day for all 5 ferrets to share.
Still no luck on whole foods, but they will eat surprisingly large chunks in their soupie. I can't wait to stop feeding soupie =( It's so time consuming, it took me at least an hour to make them up tonight's food plus two other days worth. I also added in a chunk of fish in there to see how they did with that, scales and all. So far I think they like it, but we'll see what they leave over night!
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Post by sherrylynne on Nov 2, 2010 18:15:49 GMT -5
For the salmon oil, I give 1/2 capsule every other day per ferret. Too much oil will definitely give looser stools, and although I'm not certain(can't remember right now!), I'm thinking too much could potentially prevent some absorbtion, causing lighter/yellowish stools. A normal stool for a raw fed ferret quite literally changes from meal to meal, but will usually be wetter/softer than a kibble fed ferret's For a soup fed ferret, it will be softer/wetter yet. For eggshell, 1/2 tsp per 8 oz of meat. Do a rough guesstimate using a measuring cup. So, one cup of meat= 1/2 tsp eggshell powder. If the stool is dry(ish), it sounds like you are giving too much eggshell. Can you pick up chicken wings? Try chopping those up, and putting some soup on top of them as a lure, see how they do.
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xeopse
Cageless and Roamin' Free
Raw Feeder
Posts: 235
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Post by xeopse on Nov 3, 2010 19:29:27 GMT -5
I feel like I'm bribing them all the time I'll pick up chicken wings - I've been using drumsticks and quarters so far. SOME of them are starting to use their back teeth to chew and gnaw on the ends of the quarters *crosses fingers* It usually doesn't last for long, but something is better than nothing. I think they get bored of having to work for their food. Did yours do that in the beginning?
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Post by sherrylynne on Nov 3, 2010 19:34:36 GMT -5
They sometimes STILL do, the stinkers Yeah, ferrets are pretty lazy eaters if they can get away with it The problem with drumsticks/thighs is the bone is frequently to dense for them to make much headway on it, other than the knobbly ends. The wing tips are an ideal starter bone, since it's mainly cartiledge, with a very fine bone in it.
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xeopse
Cageless and Roamin' Free
Raw Feeder
Posts: 235
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Post by xeopse on Nov 12, 2010 16:39:42 GMT -5
I've been so busy with Lulabelle that I haven't been keeping up on this (or much else) BUT I made huge progress with the little punks.
#1 I found where you can buy the shower curtain rings - Home Depot for $1.39!! I picked up 6 packages of them, so I have about 80 of them now so hopefully that will last me a while. I imagine I will need them for hanging up bedding and hammies and stuff in their new cage, so I picked up a lot more than I originally thought I was.
#2 Lulabelle kept hoarding her chicken wing after I tried it (I talked about it briefly in her post after going for x-rays the other day, she ate the whole tip of a chicken wing off!) so it was jerkified. I revived it by letting it sit in warm water for a while and tried a few more times b ut she seemed more entertained by dragging it around than eating it.
#3 So I gave it ot hte 4 other girls who were OBSESSED with it. I would play with them to get them to eat it, sticking it in their face and shakign it around enticed them to bite on and hold so nwo we play a game like that. Eventually I hooked it up ot hte shower curtain ring and really go to town. They havent' done much damage, but it's the thought that counts right now I think. Persephone is the only one that's really gotten anywhere with it - I actually took a video of her really trying to kill it despite it's all hard and gross.
Now, when do I stop letting them have fun with it? It doesn't look like it's going bad, doesn't smell or anything, but the texture is gross - it's like greasy leather or s omething LOL I'm afraid that hte bone will dry out eventually, which obviously could splinter - so how long does that take? Or does that not even happen?
How to entice them to actually EAT the chicken wing rather than just want to kill it?
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Post by sherrylynne on Nov 12, 2010 22:46:20 GMT -5
Hey, they are making a ton of progress! That's the important thing right now . I usually leave them out for about 24 hours, with no problems at all. To get them to tear off pieces, slash the meaty end so they are hanging off the bone, and if you can, cut between the long bones in the middle, and pull/cut one free at one end. The idea is that they will be able to get a better grip on the meat to tear it. As they become more experienced, you cut it less and less. And Lulabelle is stashing it because she wants it all for herself
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xeopse
Cageless and Roamin' Free
Raw Feeder
Posts: 235
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Post by xeopse on Nov 15, 2010 13:16:37 GMT -5
They are eating whatever I put in there on the shower rings. Bone and everything!! Now, how do I feed the liver and kidney since I can't exactly feed that on a shower ring. In a bowl? How do I make sure all 5 eat it? I still supplement Lulabelle on soupie since shes sick
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Post by sherrylynne on Nov 15, 2010 16:38:38 GMT -5
You could dice up the liver and put it in 5 little bowls, and keep an eye on them. They'll only be eating about 2 oz of it each anyway, so shouldn't take long. The kidney is denser, so you might be able to do the shower hook with that. But no more than the two oz of that, either. What different kinds of meat are they eating now?
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xeopse
Cageless and Roamin' Free
Raw Feeder
Posts: 235
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Post by xeopse on Nov 16, 2010 14:15:57 GMT -5
Thave eaten chicken wings, chicken drumsticks, and a turkey neck all the way to the bone and on some pieces even ate almost the entire bone. They also eat cut up pork in big chunks where I mix in blended kidney and liver so I know they eat it up. I havent' tried the liver or kidney without blending it yet, so I'll see how that goes. Do they need the organs every day? With Leia I just give her a whole beef liver and a kidney once a week or so but she is gorge/rest fed, so I only feed her about 2 or 3 times a week. The ferrets are obviously different.
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Post by sherrylynne on Nov 16, 2010 18:06:43 GMT -5
You can do either. Some prefer to feed liver/organs weekly, others small amounts daily. The only real "rule" to it is no more than about 2 oz per ferret per week. They can overdose on vit. A.(but would have very black, liquid stools before that!) It sounds like they are doing really well! Can you get hold of some heart meat? Doesn't matter what kind. They really need the taurine in their diets. If you can't find heart on a reliable basis, you can use human grade supplement. Either 500 or 1000 gram capsules, sprinkled on their food a couple times a week should do it nicely Sounds like it might be time to introduce another type of protein as well! Anything you can find is good. Beef, lamb, rabbit, goat, just to name a few.
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