In the past few weeks, I have built up to 12 bins for breeder mice trios, after moving some males that had more than one in a bin. Due to getting mice that were vey young when I got them, & many were mis-sexed, I now have to get 11 more females to have all 12 bins contain 1 male & 2 females each. One male had been killed, & a female runt was given to my baby girl, Mystic (well, not really a baby anymore, she'll be a year old in 2 weeks). I have noticed a few older females seem to be showing...I'm gonna have babies! =-) I know some younger ones didn't seem to start mating for a couple weeks after I got them. I think they were very young when I got them. I know the litters are going to be sporatic, which may make it a little easier, than several litters at once. I will keep updating.. =-)
I've found that most of the little females that I purchased from the pet store were very young. I started with 4 females and 1 male. So I was beginning to wonder what had happened and maybe that my little male was not up to the job (they were obviously too young, now that I see my first litter results). Once they were old enough they have proven themselves fantastic producers. My first batch of litters which provided me with 16 females is now producing litters (I lost 1 whole litter to cannabalism as I made the mistake of starting to clean a bin and discovered one of the mummy mice was in process of birthing, I lost that whole litter). I have another batch of 6 females awaiting a male, they were born in November and December's batch is presently in the nursery tank awaiting sexing so take care you may have plenty to keep you busy I know that I need a lot of mice but when you suddenly have 6 litters down...that's a lot of mice and I now have 12 litters in the pinky stage. Good luck....you will suddenly have more little mice than you know what to do with (of course the solution is easy, allow a couple of ferrets bathtub time ) ciao
I have a few prego females! One of my females I first brought home is about as big as a house! LOL She is as wide as she is long. A few others are getting there, but since I bought several of them at intervals, there will be staggered litters.
Can I ask why you use trio's ? when 1.5/1.6 colonys are generally as good production and less stress to the females? Either way, any chance of pics of your set-up?
Can I ask why you use trio's ? when 1.5/1.6 colonys are generally as good production and less stress to the females? Either way, any chance of pics of your set-up?
When you say 1.5 or 1.6 do are you talking about keeping them together the whole time? I set my initial bins up w/ trios based on some posts I read about other setups. In another post, I was contemplating keeping trios or having a double setup of one male in a bin, & 5 bins with 2 females each bin, & put one set of females in with a male for 10days to two weeks, then moving them to their own bin for the duration of their pregnancy, & until their babies were weaned, then after the rest of the females had spent their time with the male, putting the first set of females back with the male, which would give them eight weeks in their own bins, after being with the male. Since I already had the trios set up, I was planning on waiting to see how it worked, which males/females in this batch seem to be working out well, & if there are any that need to be removed from breeding, then re-evaluate & see if I need to change my set up.
Here is a picture of how I initially started the setup, but I have added to it since then, just haven't taken pics yet. The two big bins on top are for juveniles, males in one, females in another. I will probably get more bins for juveniles to keep track of which ones came from different litters, on the ones I want to keep for possible breeding. I will cull them at different ages, to have different development stages for feeding.
That depends on what you want, but if you keep 1 male per 5 females it means less food cost, bedding cost and smell and it gives great production, if you want you can take the male out after a week or two and move him to another bin or keep 2 males in 1 bin and then keep 2 bins of 5 females (Am I making sense) and then put 1 male into each females bin for two or so weeks or whatever you choose. As I have only got a small colony of mice now because or moving up to rats I have 8 tubs of 5 female mice and 4 small tubs for male mice. The females tubs are 14"x28" and the males are 10"x16". 2 males are kept in each tub and are put into the females tub until I am sure the females are pregnant (alot of the time they are visibly fat, not pregnant however they have the same sized belly) then the males get moved back into they're tub. The offspring I keep for "growing on" have a 14"x32" tub, males are killed as pinkys though as they sell most. I have never had a problem with this system and have had great production of litters even with the amount of females I keep per male. Also as I have stopped keeping mice for growing on to breed all my males are from different lines then the females so I dont have to worry about who is breeding with who.
That does make sense. That is kind of the other alternative I was thinking of, only more females in each bin. Hmmm, something to think about. Do you ever have a problem with females being territorial with the males being put in their bin? I read on one link that it can be a problem. I noticed some of the smaller bins tend to build condensation faster than others. These are the same ones that the mice are pushing the bedding up to the water spout & I think the water is leaking out, & they're also emptying their food bowls all over. Some of the small bins do not have a problem. I have checked water bottles & they seem to be fine, it just seems to be the "messier" mice that does it.
I have my first babies!!! =-) I checked yesterday morning (Tuesday) & mama was still as big as a house. I slept all day (I work graves) & I checked a little bit ago & there's 12 (I think) babies, & mama still looks kinda big, so there might be more. I was careful not to touch them, & I am gonna give her her space for a couple more days, before I start handling them & checking for sexes.
*I found two more litters, both had some that had been killed, or were dead. =-( They were each smaller litters, maybe 5-7. There is a few left in each one, but none of the mice were keeping it warm, so I added more bedding (shredded paper) on top. they weren't as wiggly as the big litter of 12, so I don't expect them to live, but we'll see. I gave the ones that ad been killed to the weasels. Ace gobbled up two, Xander grabbed one. Zena was curious, but wouldn't eat one. I might try a live pinky with her in her own space & see what she does. I checked on the large litter & dad was keeping them warm. =-) Yay!
Last Edit: Jan 21, 2009 18:26:30 GMT -5 by nwheather
Nope, never had a problem with them being territorial. There is a few squabbles but that is usually the pregnant mums which is normal. As for the condensation that needs to be sorted ASAP as its not healthy for the mice (; . I started using really shallow bins a while ago and humidity is between 4% and 12% now depending on the weather as opposed to the 16%-27% is used to be. Generally I don't think mice in tubs should have any more room then enough for them to be able to stand up comfortably when full grow, for this reason I have put levels into the aquariums and will be getting a diamond glass cutter from E-bay to put a "window" in both sides for more airflow. I also use wood pelleted litter and scoop out any wet bedding every 2-3 days if necessary (usually if there is a few litters in the aquarium) to also help humidity. As for the water bedding being pushed up to the water bottle spout, I had this problem and it was baby mice trying to reach is easier bless 'em! I lowered the bottles and had no more problems apart from one male and the pelleted wood litter can't be piled up to the water spout so I have no problems any more. Oh and for food, I use Tupperware containers that are about 10" high and then put a small mesh ramp going up to it so no bedding can be pushed into the container and it doesn't get spilled everywhere, haven't had any problems as of yet. Keeps food fresher for longer. PS. Congrats on the babies.
Post by animalsgetrevenge on Jan 21, 2009 14:22:24 GMT -5
YAY babies! My mice and rats haven't had any litters that big yet, you are lucky! I'm sorry to hear about the baby killers. My first rat litter just came a week ago and I caught mama in the act of eating a baby... sick stuff. Luckily, she kept 9 of her babies and they are growing and getting big!
I had a condensation issue when I used potting soil for litter. Now I use aspen shavings and haven't had any issues with my with tanks, which have screen lids.
harrisi, do you have pics of your new setup? I was wondering if gluing a wall of sorts to keep the food & bedding away from the water spout. Something tall enough to keep debris out, but they can climb it to get water. I have some mice who like to fling food out & eat off the floor of the bin. I use shredded paper for the bedding. I only have a couple bins with the condensation problem & it's a couple of the smaller ones, no probs with the bigger ones. What I may do is finish making more bigger bins, & switch to the higher ratio of females in each bin & reduce the number of overal males I keep for breeders. I might try moving the shelves that the bins are on to another part of the room, to see if that makes a difference. One of the litters that I noticed later had a female that was killed, not sure by the other female or the male, but it was within 24hrs of the babies being born, so I figured it was because of that. I may have 13 in the one bin. Am down to five in one of them. A new female was killed in the one of the bins w/ babies. She was added a week ago & I didn't thing the other female was pregnant. It was a bin that ended up with two males because the pet store had mis-sexed them. Am down to three babies in the third litter. That one had a few killed this morning. I read that they can kill their babies first litter, & it said to watch the first three litters, to see of the female will keep killing her babies. I am going to work on setting up a few larger bins & work towards having the larger bins with more females. I will keep the smaller bins for separating the babies, so thay can grow bigger before feeding them to the ferrets.
Dont at the moment, but might be able to get some tomorrow. If they are prefering to eat off the floor, try get some dried meal worms or something and hide them in the bedding. Some just like to forage! I definitely prefer the 1.5 ratio to 1.2. Much less male smell, this house is already rules with testostorone (sp?) as it is!
I think I lost one of the litters, It was already down to 3 babies, ther rest had been killed, & I didn't see any today, but I didn't want to dig through the bedding. There was still 4-5 in the other small litter & I didn't count the large litter that has 12-13, but I think they're doing very well. Here's a pic of the large litter-I snapped a quick pic while mom was eating.
One did, one of the smaller litters, that also killed some babies. If I remember offhand, I think it's the one that has no babies left. I found the other female dead, & then shortly after I found the babies. I added high protein dog kibble & a dog buscuit to each of the bins, I read that might help. I read that it can be common for mommas to kill the babies first litter or two, & some just do that always, so I will be watching. If any of them keep killing other females though, I will offer them up to the weasels, I don't need them diminshing my breeding stock.